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Joined: 03 Jul 2005 Posts: 370 Location: Amarillo, Texas

From Modern Shotguns and Loads "For my own use, if I could own but one gun, that one would be a 16 bore, 6-3/4 pounds weight, 30 inch barrels, one barrel modified and the other full choke, and I'd be liable to say, 'Get thee behind me Satan for you cannot tempt me any further."

I was reading tonight and came across that sentence.

Mike

Interesting quote from the Major! However, I never had his willpower...every time I see another gun that strikes my fancy, I have to start thinking about how I could get it. The devil just won't stay behind me! Lord help me! Not only do I listen to him much too often for my own good, I am a lawyer and a lapsed southern baptist who became an Anglican! Twisted Evil

Rev Dr. Drew may have to put in a few kind words for me with the man upstairs!
OSL

Lets see... 6-3/4 lbs., 30 inch barrels. Hm. Sounds very close to my 16 ga Citori with 28" barrels. I doubt the Major would quibble about 2" of barrel length if the gun balanced right. I think the Major and I have common ground here. How about that. Laughing

Annie oakley's favorite trap gun was a 32" double 16 ga of just over 7 lbs. her handload of choice using Shultz finest willow charcoal black powder was reportedly 15/16 ounce of hand thrown #8 shot, but actual weighing revealed it was closer to 7/8 ounce. That is the combo she used to beat Britain's finest doubles shooter at his own game. He of course, used a British best 12 ga double. She did it while with Buffalo Bill's Wild West Show during its tour to England. Her feat was a world wide sensation. I'm betting the lighter recoil and better balanced gun helped her wear him down. It was a marathon round.

Actually, those shotgun dimensions and weight have been a favorite of wingshooters for several centuries now. The best English percussion doubles were close to 14 bore by today's measurements, with 32" barrels and weighted....you guessed it.... 6-3/4 pounds give or take a bit. Some things never change.

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

Guy, I'm guessing that back in Askins' day, there would have been one significant difference between his "one gun" and your Citori: the barrels on his would have been aligned just like his eyes, rather than stacked one on top of the other.

What he described sounds like a pretty fair pheasant/prairie grouse gun to me, although I'd opt for more open chokes.

And Guy, you're making quite an assumption there with your claim that Little Miss Sure Shot's trap gun was "better balanced" than whatever the English shooter was using. Best guns tend to be very well balanced. That's one reason you pay the big bucks for them. And they also come in forms other than that of the traditional game gun, and my guess would be that a champion target shooter from that day, even a British one, would have been using a target gun (purpose built for either live pigeons or trap) rather than a game gun.

I thought he was a colonel?
And I'd say he was referring to a SxS also.
He was one of my fave gun authors along with Aagard. Had a way with words some didn't like; but I did. One such was 'moribund', as in 264 Winchester Magnum.

For OSL and you squirrel hunters out there:

There were four country churches in a small southern town;
The Presbyterian Church, the Baptist Church, the Methodist Church, and the Episcopal Church. Each church was overrun with pesky squirrels.
One day, The Presbyterian Church called a meeting to decide what to do about the squirrels. After much prayer and consideration they determined that the squirrels were predestined to be there and they shouldn't interfere with God's divine will.
In The Baptist Church, the squirrels had taken up habitation in the baptistery. The deacons met and decided to put a cover on the baptistery and drown the squirrels. There were twice as many when the baptistery was opened the next week.
The Methodist Church got together and decided that they were not in a position to harm any of God's creation. So, they humanely trapped the Squirrels and set them free a few miles outside of town. Three days later, the squirrels were back.
But -- The Episcopal Church came up with the best and most effective solution. They sprinkled the squirrels and registered them as members of the church. Now they only see them on Christmas and Easter.

Member Joined: 18 Nov 2005 Posts: 398 Location: S Fl

[quote="onefunzr2"]I thought he was a colonel?

Charles senior was a major. His son Charles made light colonel, or was it full bird? Can't recall.

Pete

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

Drew, I believe boy squirrels can now marry boy squirrels, and girl squirrels girl squirrels, in the Episcopal Church. Meanwhile, the Presbyterians are all confused because they can't decide whether to call God he or she. Some preachers switch back and forth, which confuses the congregation no end. Personally, I think He was predestined to be a He.

revdocdrew:

In the Presbyterian Church in Union Springs Alabama the squirrels ate ALL the romex insulation off the electric wires in the attic - every last inch. When a slate tile slipped off the roof, the roof repair folks discovered this - there was about 1500 feet of exposed copper wire laying on top of rafters and insulation Shocked

. Needless to say, boy squirrels, girl squirrels or cross-gendered - NONE were permitted to enter the attic once all the wire was replaced and many homes in town ate squirrell for a while Smile

.....And a fitting end for them all......

Larry, I've handled a few of these old English black powder breechloading trap guns from prior to the turn of the century. They are stocked with more drop than most game guns and very barrel heavy by comparison to boot. They were never meant to be a game gun in the remotest. they were designed for a very erect, premounted formal style of shooting. English style trap shooting was ritualized and followed a gentleman's stately pace. It was not at all like columbaire or live pigeon shooting. It was very close to what is now American style trap.

Ms Oakley was niether formal nor staid. Although she normally exhibited immpecable manners, she often skipped into the arena or onto the stage like a school girl. She always appeared to be very light hearted and young. She was after all a practiced performer and a darned cleavor actress. This was her stage persona. It endeared her to her fans. Her personna also influenced women actresses for decades to come.

She also used a lighter, straighter stocked 16 ga shotgun which was said to be very evenly balanced and quick to the shoulder. She had several sets of matched guns for her shows. She would often break targets with great speed as the guns were passed back, loaded with very light, short range loads for her, and handed back one right after the other. The targets were often rapidly hand thrown by her assistant (often her husband) in such a way as that targets were constantly in the air as she was passing and shouldering her shotguns. Often, more than one assistant was throwing targets at the same time. This type of rapid shooting required a great familiarity with and close fit of the gun. It also required a degree of dexterity not seen today. It was her extreme degree of coodination, dexterity, quickness, stamina, and unerring accuracy while performing that impressed the crowds. She also constantly practiced her style to perfection. She was used to long days of high volume, rapidly paced shooting.

It was noted during that famous doubles match, that Annie broke her targets with amazing quickness and speed when she took her turn. She was rapid to the line and on the line, yet maintained that same lighthearted personna throughout the match.

This played on the English champ's nerves. He was out to not only beat her, but humiliate her. He was being shown up in a number of ways by what appeared to be a mere slip of a girl who made it look not only easy, but feminine too. She simply blew his chauvanistic mind with her act. He sped up his pace to match her's, and lost. She just plain wore him out. She was used to rapid, high volume shooting and her equipment matched her purpose. He was not and his equipment was meant for more staid shooting. He might have been the best at his game, but he tried it Annie's way, and she whipped him soundly. She never accepted a rematch either. She knew better than to try it twice. He was too good.

There were more accurate shots than Ms Oakley, but none quicker, surer, or as vibrant as her. She was a true American treasure and her legacy lasted well into the 20th century.

PS, I'm not noted for being a religious person. Some would call me downright heathenous, some much worse. However, if there is a god, he must have created us as we are for his own amusement. I'm sure that if and when we ever stand eye to eye, he or she or even it is gonna bust out laughing at our fool notions of what things should be or are.\

Remember, it wasn't so long ago that most folks believed the world to be flat. Some religious types burned folks alive for thinking otherwise. So much for religion. I'll take human kindness and all I can get. It's the only thing that might save us in the end.