16ga.com ~ View topic

Federal Cartridge company e-mailed this response to my inquiry about pressure on the recent 7/8 ounce HV load in 16 gauge:

"Our Game Load brand of ammunition is a promotional load so is not described on the website.

All 16 ga. ammo from light to heavy loads has the same pressure level as dictated by the Sporting Arma and Ammunition Institute. We would hold our 16 ga. ammo to 11,500 PSI or less .

Thanks for asking."

Has anyone pressure tested these loads yet? The load is HVG16.

Mike

Member Joined: 08 Nov 2005 Posts: 3438 Location: Illinois

Is another company making this ammo?????Promo ammo is not described/We would hold our ammo to....What are they afraid of or holding back???

Hoa-I have heard that companies don't post pressure data due to liability. I really didn't expect much when I queried Federal...but what thehell!

I have shot them in a Sterlingworth. They make a lot of noise, kill birds like ruffed grouse and various pen raised poultry we use in pointer and spaniel events that I gun for. I usually stick to Fiocchi or Federal game loads like the one ouncers listed in the Reloaders spreadsheet, and also load my own. However, I think a Fox gun with an action as tight as they are supposed to be, could handle higher pressure. Do I need high velocity? No. Let me know if you run into someone that had the 7/8'ers pressure tested. Mike

Member Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 781

Federal is stupid.

Liability could be greater as the result of withholding known information from users of their product that have a reasonable need to know the specifications, than from sharing the information. It's like ingredient statements on food products.

The only liabilty that would result from releasing the information would be if the information proved to be inaccurate. As a result they might need to disclose the range of deviation from their designed specification. If that range is big enough on their cheap promo ammo it would make them look bad. Embarassed

Jeff

This is the way I see it re:pressures in factory shells.

1. The company wants a shell that will function in a modern gun including autoloader......ie don't want low pressure. and that meets SAAMI specs

2. Customers want to know the "power" of the load...ie speed in fps, or dram equivalent. and the weight of the load.

3. Few customers are interested at all at the pressures generated

4. Companies may change powders or other components as needed to obtain the load that satisfies points 1 and 2.

5. In doing #4 the pressures generated may change a fair amount
but they don't care as long as the pressures are high enough to function an autoloader and are within SAAMI specs

6. So, if you are told the pressures generated by X brand today, it may not be the same as from a lot from last year, or next year.
This is readily apparent when you look at measured pressures from different lots of factory loads.

7. For those of us with old guns and concerns about pressure, it pays to find out for yourself. So you can submit loads to guys like Tom Armbust and get the actual pressures and velocities. That is why I'm a paying member of the 16 ga reloading group.
I know what loads I can make up for my guns and feel comfortable.

Jeff

Member Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: Michigan

jchandler,

You are 100% correct. I'd have to agree with you completely.

Federal makes a low pressure load in 12 gauge. i shoot them in my LC Smith. They are advertised as 5500 lbs and not for use in autoloaders. they are available from Midway. If they can make them in 12 gauge, why not 16?

Member Joined: 15 Jan 2007 Posts: 40 Location: California

Hold it a second. Federal did NOT tell you what pressure that load generated. What they told you was that it did not exceed 11,500 psi and met SAAMI. Following corporate legalese style doublespeak they gave you an answer. The true pressure level of those shells is unknown. It could be anything below 11,500 psi.

The only way I know to find out is, as others have suggested, to have it tested. You might be very surprised at the results. Don't you just hate it when they give you a crappy answer like this just so you will go away?

P

I've been trying to get Federal to come out with a milder version of this load at about 1150-1200 for recreational shooting. It would be a very comfortable to shoot skeet and clays load. So far, nada. I'll keep asking.

I bought these shells from Midway, Federal 12 gauge 7/8 oz. loads, 1200 fps. They're not for use in auto's.I use them in my FC Smith,damascus barrels. Less recoil then The winchester lite loads. They do take down a grouse. Haven't tried them on pheasants.

Member Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: Michigan

Federal Cartridge company e-mailed this response to my inquiry about pressure on the recent 7/8 ounce HV load in 16 gauge:

The 12 gauge is different than the 16 gauge load they are talking about.

I quess I don't quite understand? Are they saying they can't make a light load in 16 gauge, or they just don't want to? That was part of the demise of the 16. Everybody thought they had to have magnum shells so they started making the 16 on the 12 gauge frames. If you were going to carry a heavy gun , it might as well be a 12. I saw what can happen to a sxs sixteen using magnum shells. My son was using my Fox sxs and insisted in using magnums in it. One repaired stock and then one new stock later, he doesn't use it anymore.