16ga.com Forum Index
Author Message
<  16ga. Ammunition & Reloading  ~  Keeping busy til fall and I oughta reload
revdocdrew
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 5:27 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 2016
Location: Glendale, AZ

Since it's 6 mths until the game preserve up near Prescott opens and it's cool enough to meet SquareLoad and his GSP and start some bird work for my setter pup, and all this talk about S. Dakota and Kansas is making me crazy, I'm trying to occupy my pea brain with researching/planning/ordering/finding in stock (a huge issue)/patterning 16g. loads for my pheasant gun Sterlingworth choked R .010 (Lt mod) and L .020 (Imp mod)
I understand this problem would all be solved if I'd just reload Mad There-I said it so you don't have to.
Need a load for preserve chukar and another load for big, wild, hard to kill Ks and S. Dakota pheasants. This has all been discussed over in General Discussion on the '1 1/8 oz loads?', 'Pheasant Hunting', and 'Kansas roosters-shot sizes' threads and others BUT finding what you want is another issue.

The preserve chukar should be no problem for 1 oz 6s. I've gotten a box of Winchester Game Load and Federal Game Shok, both at 1165 fps, for less than $5 at Wal-Mart but I'm not so confident in how they'll pattern. WilliamLarkinMoore has 7/8 oz loads made for them here in Phoenix in 5s and 6s: but they don't have any now and are $8/box.

A step up in a 1 oz 6 would be: 1. Kent Ultimate Traditional Upland at 1200 fps BUT $8 per box plus shipping (but I can order just one box and went ahead and got two) 2. Eley Grand Prix 15/16 oz at 1225 in UK 5s (our 6s) but for $86/ case plus shipping. 3. ARMUSA HiVel 16 but $130/500 + shipping.

I really want slightly more than 1 oz 5s in the R brl (and likely 4s in the L) for wild birds BUT I'm a recoil wimp. The only options for 5s are 1. Kent Tungsten Matrix Pheasant 1 and 1/16 at 1315 for $16/box Shocked (still waiting for my 2 box order placed 4 wks ago) or 2. B&P F2 Classic 1 and 1/16 at 1280 for $60/case + shipping BUT THEY'RE OUT AND DON'T KNOW WHEN THEY'LL ARRIVE FROM ITALY. Went ahead and back ordered a case and at least they have a distribution center out here in Tempe.

For my left brl-if I can handle the recoil in my 6# 10oz 28" Sterly-I'd like either 5s or 4s and maybe 1 and 1/8 oz. 1. Graf and Sons has no Fiocchi Golden Pheasant in 4s or 5s and don't know when they'll get any 2. I did find a box of Federal Classic Hi-Brass at 1295 in 4s which I will pattern 3. Winchester Super-X is available in 4s and 6s-also at 1295.

SOOOOO-when the loads arrive it's off to Ben Avery with a stack of pattern sheets and a bottle of naprosyn. Will let ya'll know how it turns out when my ears stop ringing and the spinning stops.
AM I MAKING THIS HARDER THAN IT HAS TO BE Question (at least I've got something to keep me occupied til fall-maybe I could train the dog to put the pattern sheets up for me Idea Might work with a setter, a lab would just eat the pattern paper and chew on the stock of the Sterly when I wan't looking. Wink)


Last edited by revdocdrew on Sun Apr 16, 2006 1:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
hoashooter
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:00 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 3436
Location: Illinois

First I would spend the time training a LAB---that should occupy about two weeks Wink Shocked Next I would take that what did you call it???anyway that old shotgun and nail a graco to it to reduce recoil-or use large lag screws.There's nobody locally who loads for the 16 you can trust????Hmmmm----did you say MEC Sizemaster in 16---You won't regret it ..unlike some unwise gun purchases Twisted Evil Crying or Very sad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Wolfchief
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:33 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 782
Location: Indiana

rev---I don't know for sure what all you might plan to hunt, and I hope this doesn't step on any toes, but maybe you are complicating a relatively simple issue....for pheasants, you don't need Golden Pheasant Fiocchi's at $11/box. You don't need ounce and a quarter loads. Certainly, one does not need 3" shells the great most of the time (and I realize you did not advocate those either in your post).

The Remington black Heavy Game 1 1/8 oz. load or the Winchester hi-brass 1 1/8 oz. load in 16 ga.will kill any pheasant we deserve to bag, IF we hit them in the front end at a reasonable range (example:within 35-40 yards) with an appropriate choke and we don't hit them in the rear on a straightaway shot. And these shells don't cost an arm and leg either. I used them to shoot 13 birds in South Dakota last fall with a 16 ga, full choke Model 12 at ranges from 10 yards to about 40. In 2004, out there I used a mod. choke 20 ga. solid-rib Model 12 and 1 ounce of #5 Super X's. They worked fine. I think the answer is not so much "hitting them hard" as it is hitting them RIGHT.

I am no expert but have shot a number of birds, and have killed many wild pheasants with a 20 ga. and 1 oz. of 5's or 6's. The 16 gauge's shot load, weight and balance are just about perfect for wild ringnecks. As always, a good dog helps immensely. Sometimes they get jumpy or are pressured and they flush way wild. When they flush too far out, I just don't shoot.

Good luck in your ammo selection; you'll have fun whatever you use---pheasant hunting is one of the finest, most fulfilling activities I have ever engaged in out-of-doors.

_________________
One Man with Courage is a Majority
---Andrew Jackson
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ron Overberg
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:36 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Posts: 591
Location: Plains, MT.

Revdock,
Try ordering from Ballistic Products. The 1 1/16 oz. Matrx was $11.35 for a box of 10. My last flat was $261.15 for 250 rounds. Not great but as cheap as I can find them. With a wildlife management area near I shoot it all the time.
Best,
Ron
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
revdocdrew
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 8:34 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 2016
Location: Glendale, AZ

Thanks to all and keep those ideas and opinions coming (other than the doofus lab thing-hard to get mad at labs though cause they're always so HAPPY out in the field Very Happy )
I probably should clarify that I'm not sure my wussy flinch can handle 1 and 1/8 loads as they are just at my limit in my almost 8 pound #2 frame 12g. Parker Trojan. I'm hoping one of those 1 and 1/16 oz 5's will pattern well, hit the birds hard (as Wolfchief said, when I do my part), but not recoil to the extent that I can't get my head back down on the stock for the second shot.
As I mentioned in another thread, I tried to use a 20g with 1 oz 6s and just didn't have the confidence that I could kill the birds dead in the air, especially with going away shots. No doubt 1 oz will pattern better out of my 16 though.
Last thoughts-1. It kills me to leave wounded birds in a field to die. 2. If my only goal was harvesting birds-I'd use a Benelli SBE with 1 and 1/4 of 4s. But if that was the only reason I was hunting-I'd quit hunting. 3. Adding up the cost of travel, motel, gas, food, guns, and licenses (this fall in 4 states), the difference between a $8 box of shells and even a $15 box doesn't amount to much IF the more expensive shells kill one bird/shell rather than taking 3 shells to lose one.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
TJC
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:25 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Posts: 1522
Location: NH

We don't have wild roosters here in NJ but I do hunt patches of milo where roosters and hens (we can shoot hens here on state lands and private clubs) will flush 40+ yards out.
I've found that the Winchester heavy game loads in 4's work real well. The Federal heavy load did not pattern well out of my Merkel but worked well in my Citori Feather.
But the best load going is the Fiocchi GP. Without a doubt, it knocks the birds out of the air. I am convinced that the plated shot really penetrates on the birds from all angles. I've still got 4 boxes waiting for next fall. The Cabella's in Pa seems to always have at least 6-8 boxes on the shelf. I'll be keeping an eye on the place this summer and will pick up what I can to lay in a supply for next year.

_________________
A bad day of hunting is better than a good day of work.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
revdocdrew
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:47 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 2016
Location: Glendale, AZ

Went back through several threads about shot size and loads for pheasants in the 'General Discussion' forum.
Everybody pretty much agreed ANY load will kill a pheasant if you can shoot them in the head, the problem is the late season and going away bird. AND everybody agreed you need to adust the load to the circumstances.
So here's a rough poll:
mod11rem- 1 1/8 4s
Dr 16g- 6s
16GG- 1 oz 6 to 1 1/8 5s
Larry Brown liked B&P 7s and 6s and Kent Upland
TJC- 1 1/8 Super-X 4s and esp. Fiocchi GP in 5s
SquareLoad- 5s
Cedar 16-5s
brdhnt- GPs 5s
Longwalker- 1 1/8 5s
jparkers- 1 oz 6 to 1 3/8 4s Shocked
Wolfchief- 1oz 6
JC Morella- 1 oz 5s and 6s
NE- 1 oz 71/2 and 6
kb- 5s
Ron Overberg- Kent Matrix 5s (Ron-is that because you have to use non-toxics or just like the load?)
Fin-did you ever get to try out those Kents you bought?
Dave M-only shoots gold plated shot in his Parkers
Brad6260-still trying to figure out what the second trigger is for Question
hoashooter-doesn't need to carry shells. His lab catches the birds in the air, cleans them, starts a fire, prepares a field lunch, and then pukes up some unidentifiable animal carcass he ate in the last cat-tail slough Wink
What say the rest of you and please name the specific shell if not a handload?


Last edited by revdocdrew on Sat Dec 30, 2006 12:56 pm; edited 5 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
CitoriFeather16
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:28 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Posts: 989
Location: Las Vegas

The last several years I have shot the Fiocchi Golden Pheasant #5's when pheasant hunting. I am not recoil shy but when a bird went up it was usually 50/50 which one of us hit the ground first when I pulled the trigger on my Citori Feather.

This summer I will be working up a good solid 1oz. load in #6 and #5 using plated shot at around 1200fps. I am going to concentrate on pattern quality over weight/velocity.

Matt
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TJC
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:50 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Posts: 1522
Location: NH

Only correction to my loads would be the SuperX are usually #4's and the Fiocchis are #5'. The Fiocchis are suppose to be available this year in other shot sizes but I haven't seen them yet. The 5's work really well.

CF16,
C'mon, I use them in my Feather without a problem. Recoil isn't bad on them. Wink

_________________
A bad day of hunting is better than a good day of work.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ron Overberg
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:13 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Posts: 591
Location: Plains, MT.

The Kent Matrix 1 1/16 oz. was the best I found for the Federal land. The best load for me in the CRP land in eastern Montana has been a hand load of nickel plated #5 in 1 1/16 oz. shell. My Beretta is 6 1/2 lbs. and this is enough of a load for me and the birds. The range for me is normally 0 to 40 yards. The chokes are SKI and LMOD to Mod second barrel. It works well for me with the #5 shot size in the field and on the splater board.
Best,
Ron
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dave Miles
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:51 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 1545
Location: Michigan

revdocdrew,
Actually I ordered 10,000 of the R-16 wads, and I'm trying to work up some good 1 oz. low pressure loads for these wads. I'm getting close. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:11 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 6535
Location: massachusetts

Geez Rev, I understand fully what you say about not getting mad at a happy lab in the field. Now, if you could just convince all my hunting buddies to treat me the same way, I'd appreciate it. After all, there ain't nobody happier to be in the field than me. I realize that like a big dumb, loveable lab, I might track mud and junk onto the passenger seat of your truck. I've even been known to barf in the cab every so often. But its because I'm just so darned happy and excited to be there. Hey. I even am willing to help eat your donuts and sandwiches too...and even give them back occasionally. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Highcountry
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:21 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 610
Location: Parker,CO,US

Rev - I am not going to tell what to use, but will tell what I have used. First I have a Merkel 1620 which Cabela's told me weighed 6 1/4 lbs, and I am not recoil sensitive. I got my Merkel at the end of the season and didn't get an opportunity to shoot it at a wild bird before the season ended. I was planning on using Fiocchi GP #5s if I did get a crack at wild birds (pheasant in KS). I was using GP 3"s in my 20 ga which have a pretty good kick but again, recoil doesn't bother me. But I have used the Merkel on three preserve hunts (two different preserves). One preserve required #6 or smaller shot, so I used Fiocchi Game & Target loads which are 1 oz and they worked great. The other preserve has a 7 1/2 shot rule so I used some Win Super Xs that I have had laying around for years waiting for the right 16 ga gun. Very Happy The Winchesters also worked fine on both Chuks and Phez.

I will be reloading in the near future when I reconfigure my P/W 375 for 16 ga, so it will be more economical to shoot clays with the Merkel.

Good luck in your quest - Hc

_________________
Let's not forget our fighting men and women in foreign lands.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
revdocdrew
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 2:49 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 2016
Location: Glendale, AZ

Thanks again to everybody.
Any experience out there with the Kent Upland Traditional load?
Is Bro Brown the only guy who's tried the B&Ps ?(gun riter guy probably got a free trip to Italy or something Wink)
IFL16-what's your chukar whacker load?
I have a strong feeling I'll be good for 1 shot each of the Federal and Super-X 1 and 1/8 loads and they'll end up as 'door prizes' out in Montezuma. Like maybe 'best performance by a setter dog actually in the same section/county as owner and visible without binoculars'? Rolling Eyes
'Most gross animal part/product barfed up by a lab in owner's vehicle'? Shocked
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
revdocdrew
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:35 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 2016
Location: Glendale, AZ

Ron suggested I check the www.ballisticproducts.com site
They have the Kent Ultimate Upland 1 oz 6s for $8
They are OUT of 16g GP and only list 5s
They DO have Fiocchi HV 16 1 and 1/8 4s at 1300 fps for $7.59 Anyone had any experience with this load? Sounds like the Federal and Super-X 1 and 1/8 loads.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
All times are GMT - 7 Hours

View next topic
View previous topic
Page 1 of 4
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
16ga.com Forum Index  ~  16ga. Ammunition & Reloading

Post new topic   Reply to topic


 
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB and NoseBleed v1.09