16ga.com Forum Index
Author Message
<  16ga. General Discussion  ~  "Balistically pure" 16 gauge
dacraig
PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 2:41 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 15 Apr 2006
Posts: 1
Location: Bethesda, MD

In the History section of the 16 Gauge website the statement is made that "A 16 gauge is balistically pure with a 1 ounce shot charge." I want to believe this (since I am planning for my next shotgun to be a 16 gauge), but am a sceptic by nature and so would like to know if anyone knows of any evidence which would support this assertion. Also, would it be true that 1 1/8 oz. loads are balistically pure for the 12 gauge, 7/8 oz. for the 20 gauge, 3/4 oz. for the 28 gauge, 1/2 oz. for the .410 gauge, etc.?

p.s. - I also sent a comment to Doug, for the reloading section section of the 16 Gauge website, saying that P/W now offers a 16-gauge toolset for its progressive reloaders (at least, that is, for the 800 Plus which I purchased), not just for the non-progressive models. - dac
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ron Overberg
PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 2:49 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Posts: 591
Location: Plains, MT.

I am sure there is an absolute answer but until it shows I have a thought. The perfect load for any gauge as it was explained years ago is refered to as a "Square Load". So for those that wish the answer a good calculator and a little extra time will give you what once was called the best shot charge for each gauge. I think you may be pretty close with your numbers.
Best,
Ron
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dave Miles
PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 3:18 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 1545
Location: Michigan

Ron, I'd have to agree with your statement. I'd just like to add, that the 16 gauge does it better than all the rest. Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
hoashooter
PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 6:23 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 3436
Location: Illinois

I have been using 3/4 oz loads with good effect lately on the skeet field and to eliminate starlings.More of a cost savings than anything else.ANY gauge can be underloaded or overloaded.Look at the 3 inch 20 ga---whata joke at the other end is the 9mm so called shotgun loads and the gun to fire them.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Terry Imai
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 2:15 pm  Reply with quote
Guest





When discussing the "optimum" load for any shotgun, most people put the cart before the horse. You can say alot of negative things about the rifle guys but the one thing that they usually take into account when choosing the correct caliber is their intended game and hunting conditions. You wouldn't want to chase a grizzley with a 223 in any weight bullet and since we as bird hunter don't have to worry that our wounded animal could cause a major problem for us. BUT under ethical guidelines, we choose the correct load that will quickly dispatch our game within our own abilities. I agree that putting too much lead in our loads will have a diminished results after a certain point but it's up to each person to determine what that exact number is and shoot the appropriate load for the size and relative toughness of the game.

Just my thoughts....
Back to top
Larry Brown
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:28 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2005
Posts: 743

The 16ga/1 oz thing is pretty much coincidence. Has to do with the way gauge is determined. The reason we call it a 16 is that a solid lead ball 1/16 of a pound will fit in the bore, and that's 1 oz. However, it's no more a "square" load for the 16 than is a load 1/12 of a pound for a 12 gauge--which, if my early morning math is correct, would be 1 1/3 oz.

It's certainly true that the 16 handles an ounce of shot very nicely. But it's not a "square load", which would mean that the shot column is as wide as it is tall, and a 1 oz 16ga load is a good bit taller than it is wide. I think the one that comes out closest to being "square" is probably the 2" 12ga, which has a very short shot column.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 10:12 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 6535
Location: massachusetts

The whole idea of the "square load" actually goes back to the muzzle loader days when a bore had the same diameter as the breech area in a barrel. 1-1-8 oz. of shot over the same Volumeof black powder, thrown from the exact same measure as the shot usually gave as close to ideal ballistics as could be got in a 12. The 14 ga, was ideal with 1 ounce, the 16 with 7/8 and so on. The 12 and 14 ga were very popular in England then. This was the approximate ga. of the Brown Bess Tower musket. The French liked the 16 as did Americans. This is because the Charleville French musket was close to 16 Ga.

The idea went out the door with the advent of breechloaders and choked barrels. The plastic one piece wad has certainly put the final nail in the coffin of the square load theory. Now, the 12 wil handle nearly 1-3/4 oz shot quite well. Turkey loads of 2 oz. will pattern nicely. The 16 will do well with 1-1/4 oz. The 20 with 1-1/8 oz., the 28 with 1 oz. Even the tiny .410 will shoot a full 3/4 oz of shot well if the shot is of proper size and well protected by a good wad design.

The key word here is shot size. The bigger the guage, the bigger the shot it will shoot well, pattern wise. This of course refers to good lead shot. As more and denser forms of non-toxic shot enter the market, even the laws of physics that govern bore to shot relationships will change. Forget the square load stuff. go pattern your gun to see how it handles a load. That is the best way to find what you atre looking for. 16GG
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mod11rem
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 11:58 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 20 Nov 2005
Posts: 117
Location: Jonesboro, AR

Larry's got it right and so does 16gg. The whole idea of uniform "guage" originally was the number of perfectly round lead balls of the exact same size that weighed a pound (16 oz) (avrodupois). 12 uniform lead balls that weigh a lb gives you the bore dia. of 12 guage and so on. It is purely a mathematical surety that 1 oz is exactly 1/16 lb and a coincidence that that shot charge happens to perform well in a 16 ga. shotgun in almost all shot sizes. That said, the same 1 oz load may or may not be the best patterning load for your particular shotgun or the shot size you require. Hoashooter gets plenty good results in skeet shooting with a 7/8 oz load and evidently shoots enough for it to make some economical difference for him. The average hunter doesn't shoot enough for it to make any economical difference. I'm a decent enough shot that 1 oz vs. 1 1/8 oz doesn't make any difference to me on live birds, but some folks might hit more birds using that little bit of extra shot. In 3 out of four of my 16's 1 oz gives the best pattern, so that's what I use. So, pattern your gun and shoot what does the best.

_________________
If I can't throw lead from a 16, I'd just as soon throw rocks.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Larry Brown
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:56 am  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2005
Posts: 743

One problem with the gauge thing is that it's based on standard bore diameter. Where the 16 is concerned, for instance, I have found guns with a bore diameter of a bit under .650, others with a BD greater than .670. I once measured a Parker 12 that had a BD of .750, while I've found others down in the .715 range. Obviously, the same size lead ball won't fit when you have that much difference.

The Brits (and Europeans in general) are much more accurate about the bore diameter than we are. For example, you get a gun with a .650 bore, and the Brits would stamp that "17". Of course the nominal gauge is still 16, because no one makes 17 gauge shells, but by bore diameter it is in fact a 17 gauge.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 12:38 pm  Reply with quote
Member
Member


Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 6535
Location: massachusetts

Amen Larry. About the only way to really know what you've got now is what the breech end will accept. However, now that subgauge tubes are commonly available, even that maxim is old hat. It just goes to show how ingenious we americans are at coming up with new ways to confuse ourselves. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
All times are GMT - 7 Hours

View next topic
View previous topic
Page 1 of 1
16ga.com Forum Index  ~  16ga. General Discussion

Post new topic   Reply to topic


 
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB and NoseBleed v1.09