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<  16ga. Guns  ~  Browning A5 Sweet Sweeter and Sweetest Sixteens Question
morngstar
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:40 am  Reply with quote
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Joined: 21 Mar 2013
Posts: 326
Location: South Dakota

Hi KGB, Thanks for the pics for comparison. Very helpful.

Please allow me to take this opportunity to rant,,,Who unsweetened your Sweet? I refuse to let them get away with that with me. Twisted Evil In my book if anything its a little sweeter than most Very Happy The reason I titled this post Sweet Sweeter and Sweetest is to put this issue on the table. Some of us take offense to commercialized, business minded, retailing, profit seeking, arrogant, snotty, misinformed and ignorant Kool-aide drinking experts devaluing our valuables. In my simple but highly biased thinking, If its rare its worth more. I am not talking about cash. I am talking about heart mind and soul worth more. Since my first experience with shotguns I have admired the A5. I had a passion for the Sweet Sixteen but couldn't afford one so I bought a Montgomery Wards 30 16ga for $75 in 1979 and pretended it was a Sweet Sixteen. It actually improved my shooting. I upgraded to a standard A5 16ga and later discovered it was an unmarked Sweet Sixteen. That was an exciting discovery. When I tried to find out how the expert that sold me the gun missed that little detail, he referred to his price guide and declared my Sweet Unsweetened. I could tell he looked a little sick when I pointed out the gold trigger, lightened receiver, stock and barrel ring. He stuck to his price guide like a Baptist with his Bible and said Sweet Sixteen are engraved on the receiver. He did concede at the end "if it is a Sweet, you got one hell of a deal." I refer to it as a Heavenly deal. That encounter lit the fuse that still burns. Pardon me for imposing my opinion but based on the reality of rarity you own one of the Sweeter of the Sweets. Three shots are also priced as standard. On the upside I get to buy the rarest and sweetest Sweet Sixteen at the price of a standard gun with a clean conscience.

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1909 Browning A5 16ga
1936 Very Sweet Sixteen, 1937 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot, 1938 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot
1947 Sweet Sixteen Three Shot, 1947 A5 16ga Three Shot, 1947 Sweet Sixteen
1935 Superposed 3 inch chambered, 16ga conversion
Browning 725 16ga
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skeettx
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:44 am  Reply with quote
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Nice Rant ! Very Happy

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kgb
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:50 am  Reply with quote
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Location: Nebraska

My first A5 16ga might or might not have been a plainclothes sweet. Didn't know any better what to look for, just liked the safety up front instead of behind the trigger.

My current gun was for sale at the Cabela's store in Hazelwood, MO and the pictures were clear enough to show the once-gold plated safety. The cuts in the receiver showed some as well. In an email I was told it was definitely a standard but when it showed up at my local Cabela's the truth was visible. Gun Library folks there didn't i.d. it either, but to be fair why should they care? All they had to do was the paperwork and funds collection.

Griff brought his stealth sweet to the Flatwater shoot last Spring and I finally had the receiver cuts pointed out to me. Got the search going at that point. I saw one beauty of a short-chambered sweet on an auction site but when I started asking questions I think the seller figured something out and removed it. They're out there.

Kirk
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morngstar
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:56 pm  Reply with quote
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I see two on the internatiinalguns auction now. One has been there for at least 9 months.

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1909 Browning A5 16ga
1936 Very Sweet Sixteen, 1937 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot, 1938 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot
1947 Sweet Sixteen Three Shot, 1947 A5 16ga Three Shot, 1947 Sweet Sixteen
1935 Superposed 3 inch chambered, 16ga conversion
Browning 725 16ga
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mechanic4hire3
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:31 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 18
Location: north carolina

This has been an interesting thread to read.....I just bought a 16ga off gunbroker this week...serial x79312. According to what I have found this is a 1953 unmarked sweet 16..all original except but plate..just wondering if anyone can tell me the difference between standard wt and sweet 16 if its not marked? Will try and contact browning Mon...thanks in advance...
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tramroad28
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:56 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 20 Jul 2011
Posts: 625
Location: Ohio..where ruffed grouse were

"Sweet" would be best considered an adjective rather than a noun......creates much less angst thataway.
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rudolph31
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 9:53 am  Reply with quote
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mechanic4hire3 wrote:
This has been an interesting thread to read.....I just bought a 16ga off gunbroker this week...serial x79312. According to what I have found this is a 1953 unmarked sweet 16..all original except but plate..just wondering if anyone can tell me the difference between standard wt and sweet 16 if its not marked? Will try and contact browning Mon...thanks in advance...


Sorry to say you've got a Standard model. Browning began engraving "Sweet Sixteen" on the receiver sometime in 1948. The good news is that the few ounces saved were mostly a marketing gimmick and you probably wouldn't notice the difference.

Enjoy your Auto-5!
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rudolph31
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 10:07 am  Reply with quote
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I guess I really didn't answer your question. Sweet Sixteens are made lighter by:

Lightening holes in the barrel ring, lightening cuts in the receiver, and a lightening hole in the buttstock.

Originally they were identified by a gold plated safety and trigger. As I said, they started engraving the name in 1948. In 1951 they started using a cross bolt safety and that wasn't gold plated.

I have a 1948 unmarked Sweet, I guess one of the last.

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popplecop
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:14 pm  Reply with quote
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I'm a little envious of the 16 ga. 3 SHOT MODELs, mine is a 12 with a solid rib barrel from 36.. Would be nicer if it were a 16, but do have a standard 16 from 32 and a Sweet from 61, so am happy for that.

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morngstar
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 3:38 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 21 Mar 2013
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Location: South Dakota

The bottom 3 are my 16ga A5 3 Shot Notice the short fore arms


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1909 Browning A5 16ga
1936 Very Sweet Sixteen, 1937 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot, 1938 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot
1947 Sweet Sixteen Three Shot, 1947 A5 16ga Three Shot, 1947 Sweet Sixteen
1935 Superposed 3 inch chambered, 16ga conversion
Browning 725 16ga
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mechanic4hire3
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 4:53 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 18
Location: north carolina

Wow... those are some Sweet 16s...pun intended. ...
What can you all tell me about.
X7168.....
Are all of the X Serial numbered guns just regular 16s?....
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morngstar
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:50 am  Reply with quote
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Location: South Dakota

Hi mechanic4hire3, Thanks for the post. The X series is the first production of post WWII 2 3/4 Browning A5s. A few non-X series A5 were made from pre-war parts as FN exhausted old inventory. The Browning X Series A5 were offered in Sweet Sixteen and Standard weight models. A very few were ordered in 3 Shot (Standard and Sweet Sixteen). The X series Sweet Sixteen made in 1946 and 1947 are not marked Sweet Sixteen. Happy Hunting

Very Happy

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1909 Browning A5 16ga
1936 Very Sweet Sixteen, 1937 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot, 1938 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot
1947 Sweet Sixteen Three Shot, 1947 A5 16ga Three Shot, 1947 Sweet Sixteen
1935 Superposed 3 inch chambered, 16ga conversion
Browning 725 16ga
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morngstar
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:00 am  Reply with quote
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Joined: 21 Mar 2013
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Location: South Dakota

mechanic4hire3 wrote:
What can you all tell me about.
X7168.....


If X7168 is the complete number it is a 1947 gun. Got Pics?

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1909 Browning A5 16ga
1936 Very Sweet Sixteen, 1937 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot, 1938 Sweet Sixteen 3 Shot
1947 Sweet Sixteen Three Shot, 1947 A5 16ga Three Shot, 1947 Sweet Sixteen
1935 Superposed 3 inch chambered, 16ga conversion
Browning 725 16ga
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mechanic4hire3
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:00 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 18
Location: north carolina

Thanks for the reply...I have a chance to get the 16 with the serial number mentioned in previous post..X7168......just wasn't sure if it was a sweet or regular 16..2 barrels...and I dont know if they are matching...so are you telling me this is a non marked 16?... it does have gold trigger but not gold safety...thanks..
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Trapdoor
PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 1:47 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 27 Sep 2014
Posts: 1
Location: Central Florida

morngstar wrote:
fn16ga wrote:
Post some picture and tell me about the unique features , I can get in touch with H M Shirley through a friend of mine .


Thanks for the offer to contact H M Shirley.

PS. On a serious note, the historian also informed me that HM Shirley passed away last year. I was genuinely saddened by that news.
I am new to the forum and this is my first post. I have known HM Shirley for some time, but did not realize who he was until earlier today. I spoke with him in person, less than an hour ago. I am pleased to report that he is alive and well and lives near me. He and I frequent the same gunshop and often just sit around and shoot the breeze for hours at a time. I do not have his contact information but do see him frequently on Saturday's. Apparently the Browning historian was incorrect.... Thankfully. I find it to be amazing just how many well known firearm collectors and historians frequent this shop. I am so lucky to be surrounded by a treasure trove of information.
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