16ga.com ~ View topic

Joined: 05 Apr 2014 Posts: 5 Location: Rosedale, IN

Trying to find load info for black powder substitutes (American Pioneer) in Magtech brass hulls. The only thing I can find is limited to 12 ga, and some info on wad diameters. Looking for a fairly light load for cowboy action shooting in a 16 gauge Remington Rider #9 single shot. Any help greatly appreciated.

*Last edited by skeettx on Sat Apr 05, 2014 3:55 pm; edited 1 time in total*

Hello BusterCoyote
On your first posting

First I would say please call the company at
American Pioneer Powder, Inc.
20423 State Road 7 #F6-268, Boca Raton, Florida 33498
Toll Free 888.756.7693

Next review the web site at

http://americanpioneerpowder.com/loading.html

They say for cartridge loading:

General loading instructions are to fill the case with our loose powder just to the point where the base of the bullet will very slightly compress the powder, about 1/16", when it is seated. NO FURTHER COMPRESSION is recommended or advisable and will result in increase pressures and erratic velocities! It is important that no air space or gap be left when the bullet is seated, and the use of fillers is not recommended for general cartridge shooting, but is often required and acceptable for achieving the lower velocities desired in Cowboy Action Shooting. The filler should be composed of an acceptable material as recommended by the Single Action Shooting Society. No grease cookie or lube wad is needed, and the use of one will lower the performance. Regular bullet lube is fine - no special bullet lube is required. A good consistent crimp will help give consistent results.

Any progressive loader, powder measurer, and/or an electronic powder dispenser that is safe to use with smokeless powder can be utilized when loading our powders, however, it should be appreciated as with any gun powder (a flammable product) it is imperative that conventional safety precautions be followed. These precautions would include, but not be limited to, making sure that the progressive loader, powder measurer, and/or electronic powder dispenser is properly grounded, in accordance with the manufacturer’s instructions, so that any electrical charge that builds up during the measuring and/or loading process is discharged to the ground source to avoid accidental discharge into the flammable powder product.

For the 12 gauge, they suggest 51 grains of FF and 1 ounce of shot.

There is 27.34 grains to 1 dram equivalent

So the load suggested is under 2 drams and 1 ounce of shot, a very nice
12 gauge cowboy load with very little recoil.

Hope this helps
Again Welcome
Mike

Joined: 05 Apr 2014 Posts: 5 Location: Rosedale, IN

"For the 12 gauge, they suggest 51 grains of FF and 1 ounce of shot.
There is 27.34 grains to 1 dram equivalent
So the load suggested is under 2 drams and 1 ounce of shot, a very nice
12 gauge cowboy load with very little recoil."

Thanks for the reply. Is there a simple math formula to reduce this to 16 gauge?

*Last edited by skeettx on Sat Apr 05, 2014 3:54 pm; edited 1 time in total*

He he he
Never simple
Call the company

That is the correct answer

But me, I am not that simple and
would most likely do something wrong

What wads do you have?

Mike

Joined: 05 Apr 2014 Posts: 5 Location: Rosedale, IN

I sent an email to American Pioneer. Hopefully hear back soon. Wads from Track o the Wolf are a .125 over powder card, then a .500 fiber wad, and a .025 over shot card. Another suggestion for 12 gauge was equal volumes of powder and shot. That might not be too hard to measure the hull and subtract the wads.

*Last edited by skeettx on Sat Apr 05, 2014 6:19 pm; edited 1 time in total*

Remember the hull need not be full, only that the powder, wad, shot, over shot column be tight and then you can have brass above the over shot wad.

Mike

the equal vols of shot and powder are the old standby . that's what I determined my load for my 16ga caplock .3/4 oz of shot was about 50 grns FF pyro . I'm about to load up an old double and it looks like about 65 FF and 7/8 oz ... the wrench in the deal is starting with BP workings and incorporating things like pyro and Amer Powder subs . Even though they are vol for vol , it's one of the few things that make me a little quesey . my DB is pretty stout compared to that little 16 - with a 33'' barrel , it only weighs <5lbs - the barrels are SSOOO NICE and thin !

Joined: 05 Apr 2014 Posts: 5 Location: Rosedale, IN

Heard back from American Pioneer. No data for 16. They say it measures by volume the same as BP so old data will work if I can find it. The limited old info I have found seems to be for heavy hunting loads.

*Last edited by skeettx on Sat Apr 05, 2014 6:35 pm; edited 2 times in total*

I agree with 16gaDavis equal volumns of shot and powder.

OK, set your dipper for 3/4 ounce, use the same dipper for shot and powder.

Do you have any more modern 16 gauge guns?
If so, do the testing in one of these.

Is your over shot wad tight enough to hold the shot in without waterglass or
glueing? Since you are using a single shot the recoil issue of loosing the shot is moot.

Mike

Joined: 05 Apr 2014 Posts: 5 Location: Rosedale, IN

My "newest" 16g is a Rem model 31 from the early 50s. My modern stuff is all 12g. A little silicon caulk in a small syringe makes a good low cost card glue. I'm also thinking of making shot cups from coffee filters or newspaper so I can get some velocity measurements without blowing up the chrony.

Rave on Dude
Let us know how all this works out for you

I have armor plated my Chrony Shocked

With the 3/4 dipper, I will guess 1050 fps.

Mike

if you look in the last few hodgdons dat books , there is a data page for I think pyro . it is generic for any case etc and will give any ga loads for caseings . their loads use plastic wads . this would help my situation - no choke and rusty ole barrel . i'm just gonna go the old fashioned way .

Joined: 21 May 2010 Posts: 603 Location: Victoria BC Canada

http://www.goexpowder.com/load-chart.html

There are two loads for 16 ga. I use less powder for CAS, but these loads would be safe in guns in good condition