16ga.com ~ View topic

Joined: 22 May 2015 Posts: 18

Hello and warm greeting
I am a new member and I am so delighted to join this website, and to benefit from the fruitful experience of hunters.
I am an amateur hunter, recently bought a french rifle "Robust221" in 16/70 nice almost new and I like it.
I have been offered with t empty hulls plastic and papers one. date to 1985.
some of them plastic hulls are varied between 65 and 70 mm(2 1/2) and the papers hulls are all 70mm
so this diversity perplexed me and made me confused :what components to use and reload my shot shells.?
I come her to seek help and I hope you can supply me to reload my shot shells my questions are:
1- if I want to reload a 70 mm hull using a Vectan A1 smokeless powder and CX1000/M686 primer with a plastic wads: what height should I use? please recommend me
2- the same if I want to reload with the same powder and primer but using nitro cards, cushion or vegetable wads what is the ideal height to use? please recommend me.
3- is 31gr or 30 gr heavy on 16 gauge? what is the ideal charge to reload to hunt partridge and rabbits?
thank you so much for ready and I shall be grateful to see and read all your answer and recommendations.
have a nice day

*Last edited by skeettx on Mon May 25, 2015 5:43 pm; edited 1 time in total*

Bon Jour, balladmaker

Welcome on your first posting

The Robust 221 is a fine and strong shotgun and should be able to use all standard loads.

Question #1 I would use the tallest wad and the smallest shot charge that would give you good crimps to start with. You will shoot these more at clay targets and the recoil will be reduced.

Question #2 At to height, the shot should come up to within about 10mm of the end of the hull

Question #3 I am not very familiar with Vectan A1, but look here
http://www.nobelsport.it/public/pages/ENG/schedapol.asp?ProdottoID=558&FamigliaID=0

And I would follow their suggestions and loads and then email Nobel for other options

Thanks for posting and good shooting

Mike

Joined: 22 May 2015 Posts: 18

thanks Mike for answering
I have viewed the link you gave me, and checked with the loads, with A1 powder they just supply a data for 32 shot load. i am a member of a french forum they say that 32 gr is a heavy load on the 16 gauge.
and i was wondering what could be typical among these loads:
28-or 29 or 30 or 31 or even 32 gr? I am not a clay shooter, these charges are for hunting birds such as partridges or rabbits.
in case i reload in filler with cushion and nitro cards shall I keep the same distance at the end of the hull.
thank you

28grams is the optimal load for 16 ga. 30 grams is a heavy load, 32grams is a MAXIMUM load. I shoot the 28 gram load for all upland hunting,rabbits grouse etc.

Welcome to the site.

Joined: 22 May 2015 Posts: 18

thanks byrdog for your reply
can you give me your recipe for reloading 28gr? I want to have an idea if you reload in star crimp or in round roll crimp?
could you please share with me some information about the thickness of cork or cushion wads that you use to fill your hulls? and what is the length of your rifle chamber?
if you also want to share with me some info about plastic wads length too I shall be grateful.
thank you

Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 1973 Location: Maine

Welcome to the site!
With proper wads, you could easily shoot a 24 gram load in a 16 gauge and do very well with it.
As noted above, the standard load in 16 gauge is 28 grams.
In addition to the French forums you have visited, you may want to check out this forum: http://www.gournetusa.com/forum/
They are very helpful there, and most are French or speak French.

the safest way find data is to contact the powder manufacturer or the wad maker. Component companies should have loading information readily available, that has been tested for safety.

Joined: 22 May 2015 Posts: 18

thank you Dave in Maine for the recommendation I really appreciate it , I did register and wait for approval from the site administrator.
if you could tell me about the components you use to reload your 28 hulls?
for byrdog thanks for the orientation, I really did send many e-mails to manufacturer of shot shell inquiring about components but no answer, so I find help and information only in such forums.
could anyone give me a recipe to reload a 28 gr please?
thank you

what components do you have available?

Joined: 22 May 2015 Posts: 18

hello byrdog
the components that I have right now is the following.
-empty hulls in 2 3/4 ( in 67 and 70mm)
-primers
-cork wads (15mm) thick in length
-closer cards 3mm thick
-5 kg lead shot N°7
----
I want to start reloading and if my components are great i will start , if not i be happy if you recommend me to buy components.
thank you

If you have a powder what kind is it.
I need to know the brand and name of the primers as well.
I could give you a lot of published data but all the info is for products available here I dont think that that will help you much. I assume that the hulls are Chedites and prhaps the primers as well. You mentioned Vectan A1 that is a Nobel Sport product. I have never used Vectan powders.

This Gentleman lives in FRANCE
He has Vectan 1

I gave him a load, but it is a heavier load, 32 grains.
He wants to know if 28,29, 30 or 31 grains is OK

The standard answer is follow the manual

But I do not see how a smaller percentage less powder will cause major concern. But you never know.

He wants an effective lower recoiling hunting load using Vectan 1

Mike

p.s. you have cork wads, but do you have a nitro wad to go under the cork wads?

http://www.circlefly.com/html/products.html

Joined: 21 May 2010 Posts: 603 Location: Victoria BC Canada

I tried searching the Nobel sport site in France and shotgun loads did not appear.

I found an English site that offered data sheets in pdf, for GBP1.00 each;

http://claygame.co.uk/data-sheets

GRAFS & Sons show the VECTAN loading data manual, which does not have data for shotguns;

http://issuu.com/grafandsons/docs/vectan_reloading_data?e=1795079/11745149

http://www.feskent.co.uk/loads1.htm shows ONE LOAD in 16 gauge!:

* 16 Gauge *

70mm Cheddite Case
616 Primer
1.35gm Vectan A1 (20.8 grains; See chart below)
2mm Evo Over Powder Card
17mm Evo Driving Wad (9mm+8mm)
30gm #6.5 (2.5mm) lead shot
Star Crimp

http://www.cleavebooks.co.uk/scol/ccmass.htm

A1 Vectan-S.N.P.E-Parigi/Francia
16/67 Plastic 616 CX 2000 1,40/1,45 1,55 27/28 Round
16/70 Plastic 615 CXMIL 1,35/1,40 1,50 28/29 Star

These are on the spread sheet for Vectan A 1 and cut wads

Joined: 22 May 2015 Posts: 18

good evening
thanks for your answers I really appreciate it.
skeettx, I think i made a mistake, when i speak about 28,29,30,31 I mean in grammes not in grains, so those load are for lead shot. anglophone have other ways of measures that i am not used to. in manuals I only find loads for 28grammes 30 and 32, some peoples in the forum says that the standard load ideal for the 16 gauge is 28.
what I want and I still did not get it till now regardless types of primers, variety of powders, and nay other components.I just want to know the following.
-If I want to reload a hull that have a length of 67 or 70mm with a 28 or 29 grammes of lead shot N°7 after setting the primer and pouring the powder(any kind) if I want to put a plastic wad what length shall I use? the same if I want to use a fiber wad and a nitro card and an over powder, what length shall I use for each components?
this is all I want to know regardless the type of primers, powders and the mark of the hull.?
thank you