16ga.com ~ View topic - More Patterns (WARNING-This post might contain bloviation.)

I have used the federal hull load except that I got the best patterns using a WW209 primer

Dave E , I wish I had your patience for patterning , but never have . the most I got done this summer is some messing with some 28ga mags . Just used a 24 can pop divider with a s-n-s in the middle . It was a bit of an eye opener . The lead loads were erratic and not spectacular . However , the hevi loads at 35 yds would cream a rooster(mod choke) . I believe I have my line up for this fall if a trip to SoDak is in the offing .(a 16ga M31 and my 28 Red Label which I did the patterns with)

Remember paper is paper , better shoot targets that fly before you determine that load meets your expectations !

Turkey loads are for shooting paper , flying game loads are to be shot on flying targets .

Best regards, Nick

They look good still a little dense but better. That gun outta be a killer. Dead in the air patterns for sure.

Guest

Member Joined: 09 Jan 2013 Posts: 2168 Location: Florida

*Last edited by 16gaugeguy on Mon Aug 22, 2016 9:41 am; edited 1 time in total*

Charles Hammack wrote:

Remember paper is paper , better shoot targets that fly before you determine that load meets your expectations ! Turkey loads are for shooting paper , flying game loads are to be shot on flying targets .

Best regards, Nick

Bingo. A pattern on paper is one dimensional. A shot swarm is three dimensional. Both target and shot swarm time of flight can be considered a fourth dimension, because the target flies through the shot swarm and vice versa.

So patterning on paper might be a useful indicator the load/choke combo might or might not be a good one. Smacking some clay targets at a range of distances we expect to be shooting birds is also recommended.

How's that for some pure D bloviatin'? Laughing

Guest

The purest! Wink

Un-Bingo! Stationary flat target patterning is very relevant. Of course, for sure, if there is any angular path difference between the moving target and the shot swarm, it will affect how many pellets hit the target. However, a shooter seldom encounters a target with sufficient crossing speed speed to make enough difference to invalidate stationary flat target patterning. Yes, really fast, and distant targets of high deflection angle show the effect, but this does not invalidate stationary flat target patterning as a relative figure of merit unless the shot swarm is very "patchy" along its length. An extreme example would be a big blob of shot in front with a long space of next to nothing, and then another big blob in the back end of the charge -- it just doesn't happen. Usually the longitudinal distribution tapers smoothly. That being the case, I do wonder about longitudinal shot distribution in the swarm when using layered-style spreader loads, but I digress.

Yes, you can do the math and figure out how far the target moves 90 degrees to the path of the shot swarm, during the passing of the swarm, but are the fringe pellets in on the action anyway, because they are slower, and is not the effective shot swarm length much shorter in the part of the pattern that does the work than the overall 6 to 12 feet that have been measured?

Read what Bob Brister has to say on it in "Shotgunning, The Art and Science". Gerald Burrard, Brister, Bruce Buck, E.D. Lowery, Oberfell and Thompson, etc all discovered the same thing. See some links below. The last link uses some high-speed photography. I'm sure there is more of this out there, too. You can call it worn-out conventional wisdom in which you don't believe, or you can recognize it as a preponderance of evidence -- science instead of quackery.

https://shotgunreport.com/2014/04/29/shot-string-2/

http://www.chuckhawks.com/shot_string.htm

http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/gun-nuts/2011/08/measuring-shot-string-high-speed-video

Interesting math Maximum smoke brought up. If the shot is traveling at 800 fps and the shot string in 12' long how far can a bird move through it while traveling 30mph?

Guest

If only we could get good high speed photography to capture a bird or inanimate target quartering away as a pattern passes through it.

Member Joined: 09 Jan 2013 Posts: 2168 Location: Florida

Do most of you really hunt, or worry about stuff like this?

Dale