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Dave In AZ
PostPosted: Sun Sep 03, 2017 12:21 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Oct 2015
Posts: 185

16ga mod12 . Shot some reloads from 1993 I found, old rem hulls and original Hercules herco. Plus some Win super X I found... trying to shoot up a box of old ammo I found when I organized my loading stuff last month.

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Cheyenne08
PostPosted: Sun Sep 03, 2017 1:15 pm  Reply with quote
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Dave good shooting! Pump shotguns; win Mod 12, Ithaca M37, Rem M31 in 16ga.
I am lucky enough to have all three.
I do also have a Browning 16ga BPS, but have never warmed to it like my old guns.

Great photo, thanks for sharing.

Dale

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Dave In AZ
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:08 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Oct 2015
Posts: 185

Dale,
I have often thought I wanted a M37, and a BPS. I've leaned towards the BPS because it has the tang safety. That ambidextrous safety, combined with the bottom eject, makes the gun fully usable by a lefty or righty, thus taking total advantage of it's bottom eject design. And being left handed and with 2 left handed kids, it's of interest. I shoot a right handed gun, but that's a mistake of no one telling me about eye dominance when I was 23 lol... too late to switch now.

I'm surprise you don't cotton to the BPS, I thought the 16ga being based on the 20ga frame would be just a great gun? For me I love the M12 because it was my Grandpa's gun and my main gun for 20 years or so. Can you tell a few things on why you like the M37 and M12 more? At some point I'll probably buy one or the other.
Thx!
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Gil S
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:14 am  Reply with quote
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Dave, it's easy enough to reverse the safety on the M37. The M37 is more expensive to build with its threaded barrel which is why it only needs one action bar compared with the BPS requiring 2. The older M37's are considerably lighter than the newer M37's and have always been lighter than the BPS. My 16's, plain barrel, are 6.25 lbs; 37R is 6.5 lbs and my 20 gauges vary from 5.75 to 5.875 lbs. The M37 also has a direct lineage to John M. Browning through the Remington M17. Gil
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Cheyenne08
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 12:57 pm  Reply with quote
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Dave, I am not as eloquent as Gil. The Win 12, and the Ithaca 37, AND the Rem 31 all seem to fit ME better. The weight of the BPS is not a problem, about seven pounds even. Only a few ounces more than the other three.

The high ventilated rib on the BPS seems to distract me, why I don't know. I have the 26" barreled Upland 98 with the straight stock, it is a beautiful gun, and slick as snot when working the action.

The BPS is more versatile with screw-in chokes, so if you handle one and like it, you won't go wrong, and the tang safety is a winner!

Dale

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Gil S
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:26 pm  Reply with quote
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I've wondered why the BPS's published weight in .410 is 7.5 lbs. Is it because the receiver isn't scaled to .410?? Gil
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Cheyenne08
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:42 pm  Reply with quote
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Gil S wrote:
I've wondered why the BPS's published weight in .410 is 7.5 lbs. Is it because the receiver isn't scaled to .410?? Gil


Gil, using same barrel stock as a 20, and having only .410 bore, therefor more steel?

Dale

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Gil S
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:41 pm  Reply with quote
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Sounds like it. That's why my 220(?).410 Savage weighs close to two pounds more more than my 20 gauge Savage (?) single-shot. (Can't keep the letter designations in my head and don't feel like opening the safe just to sound smarter than I really am.) To keep the firing pin centered, the .410's chamber has .3" thick chamber walls and barrel tapers down like an old Coke bottle. Eloquent my ass. Wink Gil
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Cheyenne08
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:48 pm  Reply with quote
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Gil S wrote:
Sounds like it. That's why my 220(?).410 Savage weighs close to two pounds more more than my 20 gauge Savage (?) single-shot. (Can't keep the letter designations in my head and don't feel like opening the safe just to sound smarter than I really am.) To keep the firing pin centered, the .410's chamber has .3" thick chamber walls and barrel tapers down like an old Coke bottle. Eloquent my ass. Wink Gil


Damn Gil, thought you would appreciate the compliment! Wink

Dale

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Beagleman
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:17 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Oct 2015
Posts: 168
Location: Clemson

I have the 31L, the 37, and the mod 12 all in 16 and 20ga. The 31L in 16ga is the slickest pump gun I have ever shot. It is also the lightest of the 3 at 5.5 lbs. On a all day rabbit hunt it is a grand gun.
IIRC the 37 is a 1953 model that weighs6.25 and was my favorite before I discovered the mod 31. The mod 12 is from 1939 and is a great gun in 16ga in it's own right. All are great guns and in my opinion you can't go wrong with any of these guns.
I do not own a BPS, but a hunting buddy has 16ga, and he loves it. I, on the other hand, am not a fan mainly due to the weight and fit. I lean towards guns that are older than I am. To each his own.
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Chicago
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 8:17 pm  Reply with quote
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Dave In AZ wrote:
16ga mod12 . Shot some reloads from 1993 I found, old rem hulls and original Hercules herco. Plus some Win super X I found... trying to shoot up a box of old ammo I found when I organized my loading stuff last month.



Given the results of those old shells you need to mirror the loads you were using. Looks like your old Mod 12 liked them well enough. Very Happy

Nice hunt.

Good Hunting,
Mike
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Dave In AZ
PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:49 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Oct 2015
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Thx Mike.
I was looking for the published recipe I used but can't find it... Oldest booklet I have is 1992 Hercules, 1-1/8oz shot with Herco powder, but I know I used CCI209 or Win290 primers, and the book only has Rem209. I was probably using the 1987 book or prior.

I used to like 1-1/8oz because all my dove hunting was no-dog walking them up in the desert, long range shots. Used 7.5 or #6 shot. Now I tend to not take those long shots outside 45 yards, and I like 1oz better. Easier on the shoulder too!

Of course NOW, Alliant has just ONE SINGLE LOAD published for Rem hulls in 16ga! 1-1/8oz with Blue Dot. Which is just really sad, because 1oz was always the prime territory for 16ga.

I loaded those on a Lee Load All II, still have it... I probably have the recipe taped on the top of it lol.
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elsinore401
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 9:15 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 05 Sep 2017
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Location: phoenix, az

Dave, did you get out any more? I am in Az as well and it was crazy good hunting in the desert this year.
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Pine Creek/Dave
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 7:59 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Mar 2017
Posts: 293
Location: Endless Mountains of Pa

DaveinAZ,

Nice outing Dave, I also have one of these old Mod21 16 Gauge guns, one deadly shotgun for sure, had the choke opened on our old Mod12 to C. One seriously deadly bird gun in the Grouse woods also.

Pine Creek/Dave

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