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double vision
PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:18 am  Reply with quote
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I'm in the don't mess with the barrels camp. You can't do much with the chokes anyway short of perhaps jugging.

Moderate-modern-quality loads (there's a mouthful) 1125-1200 tend to pattern a choke tighter, so try out some RST's and see how they do.

I've owned short-chambered 16's and found loading short shells easy on my Sizemaster with the short kit.

Sounds like a nice gun!
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Savage16
PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:33 am  Reply with quote
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Wahoo. You have already come out with the perfect plan all on your own-shoot it as is for one or two years before doing any mods.

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UncleDanFan
PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 3:39 pm  Reply with quote
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I had my short chambered steel barreled Husky 16 chambers lengthened and I'm really glad I did. I regularly shoot it with 1 1/8oz heavy field loads and the recoil reduction was noticeable. However, I also have a 2 5/8" chambered 1898 damascus Lefever with lightly struck barrels that I wouldn't dream of doing that to. I suspect this British gun is more like the Lefever than the Husky. Sometimes you just have to pick your battles. Wink

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Dave in Maine
PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 4:42 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 1972
Location: Maine

UncleDanFan wrote:
I had my short chambered steel barreled Husky 16 chambers lengthened and I'm really glad I did. I regularly shoot it with 1 1/8oz heavy field loads and the recoil reduction was noticeable. However, I also have a 2 5/8" chambered 1898 damascus Lefever with lightly struck barrels that I wouldn't dream of doing that to. I suspect this British gun is more like the Lefever than the Husky. Sometimes you just have to pick your battles. Wink


For whatever reason Brit guns usually have lightly struck barrels. (That's except those made or waterfowling, which we're not discussing here.) As I recall it, your Husky had very meaty barrels and a lot of metal, so taking some out to lengthen the chambers was not a bad idea. Any Dan Lefever gun is probably too lightly struck and/or old and worn to risk opening out.

Regarding short forcing cones on older guns, I once went over a Russian-made 20 ga hammergun (pre-1917 Revolution!) with 2.5 inch chambers and NO forcing cone. The internal topography of the barrel went from the larger internal diameter of the chamber to the smaller diameter of the bore in a square step. No cone. Some local guy had been beating himself silly shooting 2 3/4 promo loads through it, as well as abusing the gun (even though, like most Russian guns, it was built ruggedly like a GAZ truck). The gun got him back for it, as he'd used it to help push himself upright after falling off his snowshoes in a beaver swamp, putting his hand across the muzzles in his panic to get upright and, in the process, setting off the right barrel and blowing off half his hand.

Lesson: don't abuse your guns.

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Gil S
PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:59 am  Reply with quote
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One potential problem with shooting 2.75" factory ammo is that it will be modern ammunition which has higher pressures (and increased load weight and velocity) than what the gun was originally designed to shoot. This could potentially cause wear and tear resulting in it becoming "loose" or "off-face". Pressure affects metal. Payload weight and velocity affect recoil which can affect 90 year old wood. I don't know where the line would be crossed beyond occasional shooting and shooting modern ammo more than occasionally. That would depend on you and the amount of shooting you do. I have acquired a gun that was built over 85 years ago and has 2.75" chambers which probably weren't factory length. The barrels had become slightly loose in fit which was remedied. I can only assume that modern ammo was used in it. I have the exact same gun model made at the same time as the other with original length chambers and the action is tighter than Dick's hatband. Perhaps it wasn't shot much or shot the correct ammo. I dunno. This small sampling might not mean much, but it is a consideration. Gil
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fn16ga
PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:55 am  Reply with quote
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1. 2 1/2" shells will not pattern as well in a 2 3/4" chamber

I have never found this to true . I shoot mostly 2 1/2 " loads . They pattern as good or better in my 2 3/4" guns .
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WyoChukar
PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 9:42 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 16 Jul 2015
Posts: 2124
Location: Hudson,Wy

Modifying a gun to suit your personal needs will only increase your enjoyment of using it. As long as what you want to do is safe, do it.

As for lengthening chambers, it all depends on the metal available. I have lengthened the chambers and cones on several guns, but the taper ahead of the chamber was not severe. As mentioned, some guns are struck in a manner that wall thickness diminishes very suddenly past the original chamber region on some guns and this is more common with British and european guns. I would rather load 2 1/2" ammo than wish my fingers were still attached.

Consult a gunsmith with experience dealing in barrel alterations to these doubles; the gunsmith will know. You are looking for a man who specializes, not someone who slaps AR's together and makes firing pins for old lever guns.

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old colonel
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:37 pm  Reply with quote
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Go ahead and tube it if that is what makes it best for you.

I have a Purdey which some phillestine had cut the barrels on leaving it with no choke. I put Briley tubes in it. Because the two bores did not match, I had Briley tubed for different bores so the tubes are not interchangeable between the bores. I spent some time finding an microcell buttpad to replace the heavy silvers type pad it came with (according to the Purdey records) to rebalance exactly where the records show it was meant to be. The result is a usable gun with which I have used through several heavy seasons.

As for chamber lengthening, I passed, as 2 1/2 inch shells are easy to get and once you start on the path, you will wonder why you hesitated. Moreover, I hesitated to remove any metal (wall thickness) in the breach area of the gun.

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Dave in Maine
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 5:19 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 1972
Location: Maine

There was a Purdey on one of the websites a couple weeks back which had suffered a long string of indignities. A 16 ga, at that. The barrels had so little meat left in them someone had sent it off to Briley for 28 ga tubes. There was external "patina". The barrels may have been cut. Someone installed a nice Ray-Bar sight (in perfectly appropriate orange) in lieu of the original bead.
I sent the link to an expat friend who works on Brit doubles and I'd like to think he waited until the tears stopped before responding.
And those sellers wanted like $5k for it.

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old colonel
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:18 am  Reply with quote
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Some old guns are beyond simple fixes and in the case of the Purdey you describe only suitable for a total rebuild which is both costly to impossible in the US as getting it rebarrelled is near impossible here. My explorations into export to the U.K. for rebarrelling by Blacker or even the maker is too painful, not to mention expensive for me to do.

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Michael
Topeka, KS
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wahoo
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 5:11 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 22 Jan 2015
Posts: 345

Ok, I'm further down the road than before on this question, since I now have this fine old girl in my possession. Specifically, she's a 1929 built 6LB. Thomas Bland and Sons. Box lock, ejector gun in 16ga., double triggers, 28"bbls, 2.5" chamberings.
She is actually in better condition than I expected when I made the purchase. While a bit roughed up and worn, checkering is still hearty and original, done in the old flat top diamond style, not tampered with. All wood is solid. Action very tight, and bbls squared on face. Ejectors in time and snappy. Triggers just a little stiff/gritty (need to go into that action and clean out the old crud I suspect). Metal to wood fit is still spot on. She definitely has been around the block a few times though. Her case colors are more like a coin finish, kinda like tarnished sterling. Reminds me too of the reflecting material on an antique mirror. No dents or scratched in metal, and bores are spectacular!

The grand prize though, is how marvelous she comes up and points where I'm looking with no more effort than picking up a tobacco stick. I shot and patterned the bbls, and am very very happy with those so called "cylinder" bores. I will definitely NOT be making any changes to those bbls anytime soon. If initial impressions are correct, I will likely never seek to change what I have with them as they are now. Just gotta get the LOP corrected. Even the cast off and drop are correct for me. Wish I could show ya'll what she looks like!

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1929 Thomas Bland 16ga SxS 28"
1947 Browning A5 16ga 28"
1948 BRNO 16ga SxS 27.5"
1949 Stevens 530 16ga SxS 28"
1950 Stevens 311A 12ga SxS 30"
1952 BRNO 12ga SxS 28.25"
1963 Superposed O/U 12ga 27"
1968 V Bernardelli SxS 12ga 28"
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Dave in Maine
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:48 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 1972
Location: Maine

Bland is a good "name" and it sounds like you got one that was used and not abused.

The funny thing about these guns is the measurements might be all "wrong" for you yet the gun "fits" you in the sense that it hits where you point. No need to fuss with the stock or the LOP if it shoots where you point.

As to the internal condition, you should assume there's old oil turned to varnish inside. A friend and I are working (almost done, really) on a Brit double of vintage similar to yours. It had a lot of old oil inside which, when removed, showed a nice, bright, clean action inside, one that works exceptionally smoothly. You should invest a couple hundred in having a good doublegun smith clean it up inside, someone who won't bugger the screws, etc. Our gun had some oil in the head of the stock which came out after a couple months' immersion in whiting (powdered marble from an artists' supply store). Easy peasy for someone who has the right tools.

Congratulations on your acquisition. If you want to talk more about particulars, pm me.

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Frederick Douglass, November 15, 1867, speech in Williamsport, Pa.
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old colonel
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:40 am  Reply with quote
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You may discover that the current bores are prefect for you and need no change. Shooting it as is maybe the best choice.

That said if you want slightly tighter bores (maybe as much as a half step better) Through some reload manipulation you may be able to tighten cyl bores.

Simply using harder shot can help a bit.

A technique I have used is hard shot combined with using scotch tape wrapped twice around the plastic shot cup helped a little.

That said, for my shooting which is primarily over a pointing dog open bores work best. I rarely shoot tight barrels. For preserve I shoot Cyl (000) Skt (005) and on wild birds Skt (005) IC (015).

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sharps4590
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 5:44 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 26 Dec 2014
Posts: 164
Location: In the sticks Missouri

RST loads 2 1/2 in. shells to varying pressures just for older guns.

I was glad to read you like the gun as it is. I had the chambers lengthened in a 1935 Meffert drilling and regretted it from the day after I had it done and the rest of the time I owned the piece. Screw in chokes should never be a consideration.

No, it isn't original, however, the work was probably done in England and shouldn't hurt it nearly as much as having work done on it here. That is not an indictment of American quality, simply an honest observation.

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sharps4590
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 5:44 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 26 Dec 2014
Posts: 164
Location: In the sticks Missouri

RST loads 2 1/2 in. shells to varying pressures just for older guns.

I was glad to read you like the gun as it is. I had the chambers lengthened in a 1935 Meffert drilling and regretted it from the day after I had it done and the rest of the time I owned the piece. Screw in chokes should never be a consideration.

No, it isn't original, however, the work was probably done in England and shouldn't hurt it nearly as much as having work done on it here. That is not an indictment of American quality, simply an honest observation.

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Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools. Romans 1:22

Those who fail to study history are condemned to repeat it.
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