16ga.com ~ View topic - Availability and future of the DR

I have been thinking 🤔.

Anyone that knows me , when I get to thinking 🤔.

The next run of the DR - 16 might be the last.

I have been talking with Jeanne about tearing the mold apart and sending all the parts to the platers to be Nickel plated .

Been thinking that I can build a small hydraulic rail system to actuate the mold .

Placed in the center of my living room for an entertainment center.

Hmm just thinking 🤔.

If you have a need or want for this wad ?

I would suggest that stocking up might be a good idea.

Regards , Nick

How many cavities (wads) are in the mold. Just curious as to what it looks like.

Joined: 13 Apr 2017 Posts: 150

Why not sell it to DR?

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1844 Location: Central ND

Guys, the only problem with the DR-16 wad is this. We don't buy enough DR-16's to make it profitable enough to run on a consistent basis. Profitable means that whoever owns the molds has to be able to not only run the molds, but maintain the molds. Plastic injection molds run under a lot of pressure and to a lesser extent heat, and the machines themselves don't exactly treat the molds nicely.

Plastic injection molds are kinda like boats, there is always something you need to do or fix.

Joined: 09 Aug 2007 Posts: 444 Location: WI

I asked this question in the other thread in the reloading forum, but nobody has answered.

I've heard of the near legendary status of the DR-16 wad, but have never been able to get any to try and none ever seem to be available.

Can someone please explain why the DR-16 is so revered, what its features are that make it one of the rarest and most sought after wad, and why they are so much better than any other wad on the market?

If they are as fabulous as everyone says, I don't see why there would not be a continuous demand from the 16 gauge community if there was a continuous supply available.

GSP you deserve an answer !

I am the designer, developer and owner of the DR 16 tooling , with that said I started out to build the Marlin 90 in 16 ga. using modern materials.

I contacted Bill Hanus about the Merit and Validaty of such an undertaking, he informed me that before taking on the production of the gun I first had to solve the issue of ammunition.

We discussed wads , hulls , loads and guns for 1 1/2 hours upon where we decided that components was where the issue resides.

I embarked on the DR-16 wad project with no support from anyone , Mike Jordan of Winchester said it was a 1.2 - 1.5 million project and I simply would not be able to do it.

Jess Hamblin of Federal and later on Zanders and ultimately Browning got mad that I didn't do it in 12 ga.

Many others in the industry that had been friends or at least civil in the past suddenly grew fangs and claws.

Ole Ben Felton , 16 gauge guy and a few others were proponents of the project after dares to build it took place.

Beware of what one can do , one might loose a bunch of dollars in the process.

The DR 16 turned out to be the Bridgeport of wads , it will load 5/8 oz 11/16 oz 3/4 oz 13/16 oz 7/8 oz 15/16 oz and 1 oz all with the same wad.

Work with all commercial hulls on the market with the LOWEST STANDARD DEVIATION in velocity and pressure of any wad in any gauge across the industry.

Not a huge deal with a shotshell but still it's there ( my air rifles it's kinda big deal when one wants to eat out a tiny hole at 100 yards ) .

I conducted a small analysis of the 16 ga. Shooters that consumed 1K + of wads per year , back then it was 14 of which I was one.

From an entertainment , engineering standpoint the DR -16 was a huge success.

From a financial view point it was an utter failure.

The mold is worth more to me to sit in my living room to remind me that yes it's the finest multi functional wad in the world , yes I could do it when everyone said I couldn't , but wanted in on a piece of the action with no financial risk associated.

It's just a thought 🤔

Regards Nick

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1844 Location: Central ND

The DR-16 allows you to reload 3/4 & 7/8 oz. loads (it will accommodate 1/2 to 1 oz. with a little thought) in all of the currently available hulls with no powder migration issues with any powder. There is no other wad that will handle that range.

The one item I have found for getting good reloads with either 3/4 or 7/8 oz. is to not use wad pressure to collapse the legs. Only use enough wad pressure to seat the DR-16 on the powder. On a MEC machine you do not want to see the wad pressure indicator move at all.

I do hate to see the end of the DR 16 and will certainly stock up. Over the years I have probably used about 5K so I am not a profit generator I am afraid. It is the wad that I use the most but I just don't shoot many targets anymore. Will there be a pre order so people will have the opportunity to stock up and we don't end up with a shortfall for the last run. Thanks again Nick!
James

Joined: 16 Jul 2015 Posts: 2126 Location: Hudson,Wy

For what it's worth, probably not much, I'll give my thoughts on all of this.

The DR-16 is a wonderful wad. I used them, but when supply issues loomed on the horizon and discussions like this one began to emerge, I just adapted by using the pink Claybuster wads or the reduced capacity version of the SG-16 wads in Win compression formed hulls, RGL hulls, and 2 1/2" hulls. Problem solved. I then gave my remaining stock of DR-16's to MSM2019 since I knew he used them and I could just hand them off when we went fishing.

As far as profitability goes, Nick and Mark are right about injection mold. I looked into them for reproducing the tone boards and wedges in my goose call. My mold would be ultra simple, but even so, I would have been in the hole financially for a few years before enough calls sold.

The only salvation I see for the DR-16 is to sell it in a larger market. The only larger markets I see are either Europe or the ammunition manufacturers. Interestingly, Federal sees it profitable to invest in 16 ga. (and 28 ga.) Flight Control wads for its Prairie Storm lineup. So why not the DR-16? To be blatantly honest, we Americans as a whole suffer from "Magnumitis" and few people recognize the value of a light or mid weight shot charge-thusly there is little demand.

Joined: 08 Feb 2009 Posts: 1310 Location: Western WA

I’ve never used a DR-16. In fact, I’ve never seen one. But to me, the DR-16 signifies one thing: The exceptional superiority of the 7/8 oz load for 16 ga clay target shooting, if not upland hunting in general.

How does one obtain said splendid 7/8 oz load? Therein lies the problem: You can’t. That is, unless you use ill-fitting wads that leak powder, or modify them with lamps or billiard balls warmed in hot oil, or stuff your loads with extra fillers (a mouse consumed my 7/8 oz filler) or other sundry pieces and parts. Or you could cut down perfectly good 2 3/4” hulls to 2 1/2” hulls and wander down that lonely uncharted path, as have I (note of caution: people look at you funny when you tell them about your 16 ga 2 1/2” ammo).

Or you could use the DR-16. What a great idea. A drop-in 7/8 oz wad for the masses. It might even make the 16 ga practical again! But sadly, no good deed goes unpunished. A heroic effort to design and fabricate the mold, a manufacturer willing to shoulder the production, all evidently leading to one thing: Oblivion.

Oh well, we’ll raise a glass to those who attempted the impossible, cheers to you DR-16 pioneers.

V/R
B.

Member Joined: 31 Aug 2005 Posts: 1257 Location: Nebraska

Its legacy might be in prompting Claybuster to produce their 7/8oz wad, if it were to lead to an ammunition maker producing factory shells with that shot charge it'd be.....something altogether indeed.

Fiocchi makes 7/8oz 12ga shells, would seem to be the company most likely to eventually produce a light 16.

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1844 Location: Central ND

The problem is, regardless of how enticing a 7/8 oz. load might be, there is no place for the 16 gauge in the main stream clay target sports. The 16 gauge might, on a good day, may have 3 - 4% of the shotgun/shotshell market. That is reality. That is why the DR16 wad is where it is.

I ran a pole on this forum several years ago, there were very few folks that shot over 500 rounds of 16 gauge ammo a year......and that is on a 16 gauge forum.

I shoot about 2,000 to 2,500 rounds of 16 gauge ammo a year. How many folks actually shoot more than that on this forum, 2 or 3 maybe?

It all sounds good until you actually run the numbers.

7/8 oz. loads for hunting? Yeah maybe, but how many folks shoot more than 4 boxes of shells a year for hunting, even if you include doves. I went through about 7 or 8 boxes of hunting ammo last year, and none were 7/8 oz. loads.

Joined: 09 Aug 2007 Posts: 444 Location: WI

OK well now I want some. Like, "a lot of" some.

Say when!

I only have 10,000 of DR 16 wads left
Anyone coming through Amarillo, let me know
Smile

Mike

Joined: 21 Mar 2019 Posts: 523 Location: Texas

You willing to ship some to Houston? Pm sent on another topic.