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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 2:07 pm  Reply with quote
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Has anyone heard anything from Down range about a possible new 16 ga wad? I am hoping someone at the shot show might have some info or news. Let us know if you do. It would be much appreciated.
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Down Range Manufacturing
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 4:38 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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Hello 16ga.com,

I 'm still here. Just looking and learning!



Kevin @ 402-463-3415
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hoashooter
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 7:23 pm  Reply with quote
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DRM--A knockoff of either the AA style or the Remmy R-16 would be the way to go Cool Cool
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Dave Erickson
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 9:32 pm  Reply with quote
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hoashooter wrote:
DRM--A knockoff of either the AA style or the Remmy R-16 would be the way to go Cool Cool


I'd rather see something better than those two wads. Wider gas seal, elevated shot cup, no fillers needed for light loads.
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Slidehammer
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 11:10 am  Reply with quote
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Dave Erickson wrote:
hoashooter wrote:
DRM--A knockoff of either the AA style or the Remmy R-16 would be the way to go Cool Cool


I'd rather see something better than those two wads. Wider gas seal, elevated shot cup, no fillers needed for light loads.


I agree with Dave!

The last thing we need is the undersized blue AA wad when tapered hulls are a thing of the past!

I have no problem with an AA type wad however, better dimensioned (correctly for straight-walled hulls) and maybe a little taller for the light shot charges we all seem to like and as Dave recommends.

Slidehammer
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hoashooter
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:11 pm  Reply with quote
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Some of us have a sizable stash of the AA style hulls Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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Square Load
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:49 pm  Reply with quote
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hoashooter wrote:
Some of us have a sizable stash of the AA style hulls Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil


Yes, some of us do. And many of us also reload the Remington hulls which work best with the same wads. And I will never spend a nickel of my money buying a Cheddite hull after the way the French have treated us the last couple of decades.

Dennis


Last edited by Square Load on Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Slidehammer
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:19 am  Reply with quote
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Square Load wrote:
hoashooter wrote:
Some of us have a sizable stash of the AA style hulls Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil


Yes, some of us do.

And many of us also reload the Remington hulls which work best with the same wads.
Dennis


Yes, but the majority doesn't have an AA stash!

And you are missing the objective as well. We are trying to convince a wad manufacturer to "tool up" to produce us a wad for 16 gauge... Believe me, Kevin will look at what the majority wants and what he can sell the most of long before he makes one move towards investing money!

Think of it this way..... If Kevin was a carburetor manufacturer would he reintroduce a carburetor for a Hudson Hornet on the premise that a few people still had one??

No.........There is a design needed that is sized snugly to the Remington black, adequately to the straight-walled hulls and would even squeek into a discontinued AA hull if needed.

It could even look like the AA wad...... It just needs more diameter and a longer cushion area length if Kevin is ever going to be able to sell enough of them to recoup his original investment. You can rest assured this is paramount in Kevin's mind as he follows what is said....

Slidehammer
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Dave Erickson
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:39 am  Reply with quote
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Amen, Slidehammer!
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Square Load
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:34 am  Reply with quote
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Slidehammer,

I don't look at the carburetor on a 55-60 year old car as a fair comparison to a hull which was discontinued just over 10 years ago that a lot of people are still using. I can't remember the last time I saw a Hudson Hornet going down the highway. I personally know only 5 people who shoot a 16ga regularly. They all reload and everyone of them has a stash of discontinued Win CF hulls. They all also load the Rem SP hulls which use the same wads. None of them load straight wall cases.

I remember Kevin's original post asking what and how much everyone was shooting. If the "objective" is for me to line up with you asking for a wad that will do me no good, then I am certainly missing the "objective". If someone does make a wad sized to fit the staight wall cases, I will continue to use the Rem. wads instead of shortening the life of my discontinued AA type hulls and current Rem hulls.

The ideal situation would be for someone to make a target wad for both types of hulls since I don't think it is possible to make a "one size fits all" wad that would make everyone happy. We all know this will never happen.

This year marks the 25th anniversery of owning and operating my own business. I happen to know a thing or two about investing and making money and on a much larger scale than producing the molds for a 16ga wad.

I certainly respect your right to disagree with me but I don't deserve to be treated like an idiot any more than you do.

Dennis
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Slidehammer
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:53 pm  Reply with quote
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Square Load wrote:
I certainly respect your right to disagree with me but I don't deserve to be treated like an idiot any more than you do.


I appologize Square Load.....This was certainly not my intent. My intent was to get you to see the forest instead of trees.....In this case dead trees, as admitted in your next quote:

Square Load wrote:
to a hull which was discontinued just over 10 years ago that a lot of people are still using.


Discontinued and a lot of people using? The supply can only go down.....

Square Load wrote:
This year marks the 25th anniversery of me owning and operating my own business. I happen to know a thing or two about investing and making money and on a much larger scale than producing the molds for a 16ga wad.


Then you should realize that the re-introduction of a discontinued item to fit a discontinued item is poor business!

Square Load wrote:
I personally know only 5 people who shoot a 16ga regularly. They all reload and everyone of them has a stash of discontinued Win CF hulls. They all also load the Rem SP hulls which use the same wads. None of them load straight wall cases.


I know about 12 people (16 gauge shooters) and only one has 600 AA hulls. He shoots Federal hulls most of the time "saving" the AA's He uses and prefers the R-16 wad in the AA hulls even though he still has blue AA wads! Why? They pattern better. I also prefer the Federal hull. The reams written on the paper basewad can be managed. I've about had it with the black Remingtons body spliting during the winter. I guess Remington doesn't think anyone shoots below freezing, much less below zero! I didn't use AA hulls when you could get them so if you add me to your five 16 gauge shooters then 16 2/3% now shoot straight walled.

Square Load wrote:
I remember Kevin's original post asking what and how much everyone was shooting. If the "objective" is for me to line up with you asking for a wad that will do me no good, then I am certainly missing the "objective". If someone does make a wad sized to fit the staight wall cases, I will continue to use the Rem. wads instead of shortening the life of my discontinued AA type hulls and current Rem hulls.


The objective was to "consider" what kind of wad Kevin MIGHT make. There is nothing personal about the comment only business/monetary reasoning for said wad.

Square Load wrote:
The ideal situation would be for someone to make a target wad for both types of hulls since I don't think it is possible to make a "one size fits all" wad that would make everyone happy. We all know this will never happen.


IF...... A wad was made with dual migration rings on the gas cup.... And IF the diameter was sized so the migration rings would just touch the inside I.D. of the Federal hull, yet easily compress to the Remington black I.D. and seat no tighter than the R-16 in the AA hull (while supplies last) Then we would ALL have something! I have thought of you Square Load, during this design stage (of which I have my own decades of experience), while you insist on a AA copy of no use to me... Now I ask... If this open-minded? To repeat myself, the wad should be sized for 7/8oz as well from all I've heard on this forum as well as those I shoot 16 bore with.

Square Load wrote:
I don't look at the carburetor on a 55-60 year old car as a fair comparison


Probably so................ But it got your attention which was my goal!
In all honesty though, even in our remote Rocky Mountain area I know of two "stashes" of Hudsons. (one of six cars one of four) Yet I know only the one 16 gauge shooter with an AA hull stash......... Something to think about here I would think??

Slidehammer
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spunky16
PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:57 am  Reply with quote
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I agree with Slidehammer as well. I wish that I was lucky enough to have old AA hulls but since I don't I would be a lost customer for Downrange. Lets stick to a 7/8 oz. wad and maybe they could do two configurations for use in Rems or Cheddites or Feds. There aren't enough loaders with old AAs out there for DR to make money.And eventually all you lucky ducks that have stashes will either use them up or die. It's the economy of scale!
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spunky16
PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 10:01 am  Reply with quote
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Square load, even Beta VCR folks will one day need to give up there hopes. Wink
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Square Load
PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 2:55 pm  Reply with quote
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Slidehammer and spunky 16,

Somehow you two are misreading all of my posts. If you two will take a look you will notice I have ALWAYS mentioned the Rem hull in conjunction with the AA hull. I load far more black Rem hulls than I do AA hulls. I have never said that we need a wad specifically for the discontinued AA hull. My AA hulls are being "saved" for two purposes, my hunting loads until they have been reloaded 3 times and after that I use them for practice loads for my A-5 and 870 where I can't look down the barrel after each shot for an errant base wad. All my practice loads in my O/U and SxS are reloaded Remingtons. I have worn out hundreds of them and unlike Slidehammer I have never had a problem with a Rem case other than wishing they were good for more than 4-5 reloads. But then it is a bit warmer in AZ than in MT.

I have never loaded a single round in my life with a Win AA16 wad. I have no reason to wish for them to be duplicated. All I have ever used are R16 and SP16 wads for my 1 oz and 1 1/8 oz loads and R16 with 28ga card wad fillers for 7/8oz loads. I am very happy with the Rem wads for my hunting loads and as long as they are available that is what I will buy. I would like to see a wad that works for 7/8oz loads without a filler and if it can be made per Slidehammer's design so it will work for all 16ga. hulls and make everyone happy I think that would be great.

This is the only Forum I have ever belonged to. I have enjoyed it because the discussions are very informative, polite and open minded. If I wanted to argue with someone I would join the SS BBS and get in a weekly 5 page "discussion" with Cush!

I'm done with this one. I have better and much more productive things to do with my time.

Later guys,

Dennis
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Popski
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:25 pm  Reply with quote
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Apropos of nothing whatsoever, I saw a Hudson Hornet on the road about a month and a half ago. It was a '53, I know 'cause I stopped and talked to the owner. I grew up with a '51. And it isan't "a" carbureter, its "carburetors" as Hudson Hornets had 2 of them.

Back to the original question. I hunt with 2 guns chambered for 2 9/16" shells. Normally I like 1 1/8 oz of shot in my shells. I do not use the plastic wads for these loads as they are too long in the shock absorber section for the shorter hulls as the plastic wads are made for a specific shot weight, thus shot height in the cup and a specific hull length. The best wad for this is the discontinued Activ G-32 which was made for 1 1/8 oz loads (in 2 3/4" length shells) and is about 0.050" shorter in the shock absorber section than the Rem SP16. If I were still loading for a 2 3/4" chambered gun, that is what I would use for 1 1/4 oz loads. As it is, the G-32 wad does work (barely) for 1 oz loads in 2 9/16" hulls.

I also have no "stash" of Win AA hulls. I used Activs until they died, then switched to Fiocchi.

For the Down Range Guy. I need a plastic wad that fits the 2 9/16" hull that allows me to load 1 1/8 oz and 1 oz loads in a straight walled hull. As this is a small market I am not holding my breath that anyone will fulfil my need.

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