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< 16ga. Ammunition & Reloading ~ Why No 3'' 16a? |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 1:52 pm
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Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 4
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I just haven't figured it out why 12ga and 20 ga both have 3'' chambers available and the 16ga does. Can someone please explain this for me? |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 2:32 pm
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Member
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 1043
Location: Bozeman, MT
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I don't know. I DO know that it was done at least a little back in the early thirties or before, as I recall seeing in Scwing's Model 21 book a rare 16 bore 3" Model 21, why it never stuck, dunno, somebody on this forum will, I'll bet ya,
Duncan |
_________________ "Life is what happens to you while you're making other plans"....... anonymous |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 6:17 pm
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Member
Joined: 16 Aug 2004
Posts: 317
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Who needs a 3" 16 ga. shell? |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 6:51 pm
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Member
Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 3438
Location: Illinois
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Kinda like the three inch 20 |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 7:12 pm
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Member
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 1043
Location: Bozeman, MT
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I could get more size T buckshot in there for my coyote load.... |
_________________ "Life is what happens to you while you're making other plans"....... anonymous |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 7:32 pm
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Member
Joined: 16 Aug 2004
Posts: 317
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britgun wrote: |
I could get more size T buckshot in there for my coyote load....
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True, but a .223 is much better at displacing yotes at any given distance than a load of T shot thru any shotgun.
By the way--how does that T shot pattern thru your 16 ga.? |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:18 pm
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Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 4
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why need a 3'' 16ga?? well some companies are starting to come out with new 16ga's. That means the barrels are steel approved.....could be a great waterfowl gun. It would pattern better than a 20 ga and hold more shot. |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:25 pm
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Member
Joined: 16 Aug 2004
Posts: 317
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petrey10 wrote: |
why need a 3'' 16ga?? well some companies are starting to come out with new 16ga's. That means the barrels are steel approved.....could be a great waterfowl gun. It would pattern better than a 20 ga and hold more shot.
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Works great now with 2 3/4" bismuth or TM loads. |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:27 pm
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Member
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 1043
Location: Bozeman, MT
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RWG wrote: |
britgun wrote: |
I could get more size T buckshot in there for my coyote load....
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True, but a .223 is much better at displacing yotes at any given distance than a load of T shot thru any shotgun.
By the way--how does that T shot pattern thru your 16 ga.?
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I dare say, it's all about good sport, old boy, wot?
Well, Charlie (16gaugeguy) gave me a recipe, the components arrived just today, haven't built the 'yote bomb yet, I leave for Africa Monday, so it'll be Feb before I load, squeal like a hurtin bunny, and bust dawg....Charlie was killing them out to 85 yds, I believe he said, and he got fewer flyers with more open chokes (like Skt 2)...we can usually get them in well within that range......it'll be an adventure....
Duncan |
_________________ "Life is what happens to you while you're making other plans"....... anonymous |
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:31 pm
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Member
Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 2016
Location: Glendale, AZ
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Posted:
Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:38 pm
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Member
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 1043
Location: Bozeman, MT
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....thanks doc, looks like you guys picked this issue apart a year ago, that was some rich history, interesting reading, and showed some fine detective work, I knew it had at least been done by Win in the 21, but looks like some others gave it a brief whirl, as well.... |
_________________ "Life is what happens to you while you're making other plans"....... anonymous |
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Posted:
Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:34 am
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Member
Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 75
Location: Manhattan, Kansas
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Last year I purchased a new Charles Daley Field Hunter ( O/U ) that was the
last to be made in Italy. Now made by the Turks. The gun is labled for , and has 3 " chambers. I was told by the C. Daley folks that 3" , 16 ga. ammo is very popular and is available in Europe. It's reported to be loaded with 1 1/8 oz. of shot and some can be had with 1 1/4 oz ! . I've never
seen any and can't imagine a need for it. I sure wouldn't want to be the one firing an 1 1/4 load from a 6lb 4 oz. gun !
Rabbitdog |
_________________ Become a SHRINER...Help KIDS ! |
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Posted:
Fri Jan 19, 2007 12:48 pm
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Member
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 6535
Location: massachusetts
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Essentially, the 16 ga 2-3/4" shell is very capable of handling the heaviest shot charge that is really useful in the bore--1-1/4 ounces. This heavy charge can reach 1275 FPS with existing smokeless propellents. I have handloaded these 16 ga. magnum loads and used them on big pheasant. They are effective past 40 yards which is more than enough range for the average wingshot, so they about all she wrote for the gauge. A 3" 16 is overkill.
The frame, the barrels, and the wrist of guns built for a 3" magnum 16 would have to be made heavier, probably in the 7-1/4 pound range. Weight is the enemy of a decent 16 ga. upland gun.
Look at the average modern 20 ga built for a 3" shell. They are overbuilt for the same reasons. In fact, the 16 ga Browning Citori and the new 16 ga. BPS pump would not exist if 20 ga guns were not so over built as they are today. Miroku was able to adapt the existing frames directly without a lot of redesigning. This should tell you something right there.
If you need more shot than 1-1/4 ounces or more velocity with that weight, a 12 ga. would be more suitable. I-1/4 ounces of shot can easily approach 1400 fps in a 12 and pattern better at that velocity too. Then there's the recoil factor to address.
But you have to ask yourself realistically, just how far can the average decent shot hit a flying game bird reliably. 40 yards is a long way to be shooting at a rapidly moving and directionally unpredictable target like a game bird. I do not see a 3 inch 16 helping matters much, only hurting them. I say if it ain't broke, don't fix it. |
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Posted:
Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:38 pm
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Member
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 1043
Location: Bozeman, MT
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well spoken, and I heartily agree with you. Enough is enough, and we already have enough in a 2 3/4" 1 1/4oz. 2 3/4" 16 ga. cartridge (most of us will probably agree that it's MORE than enough as it is.)
bgun |
_________________ "Life is what happens to you while you're making other plans"....... anonymous |
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