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Member Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 43 Location: iowa

i just finished loading my first few shells on my lee load all & the finished shell length is approx 1/8" longer than a factory shell. i used new fiocchi hulls.is this a big concern? i also hope this is not a stupid question!!!! Laughing

The most common error new reloaders make is not finding the right height of the wad and shot column for the load they want. Choosing the right type and amount of powder, the right height wad, and the right amount of shot to fill the inside of the shell to the right height is critical to getting a good crimp.

Too low a column leaves too much space at the top and the crimp folds collapse inwards. too little space dos not allow enough shell mouth above the top of the shot to form a properly deep drimp rim fold or enough mouth to close the center of thre crimp. Too high a column also prevents the crimp from closing flat like it should. there must be some space under the crimp folds so the inside fold points rest on top of the shot without the top of the folds puckering upwards.

As long as there is not a big hole in the middle of your crimp, the folds are flat, and the crimp folded rim is about .053" deep, your crimped shell should stay closed and the finished length is of little importance.

However, I've got a sneaking suspicion your finished crimp fold depth might not be deep enough to keep the shell closed or your shot column it too tall inside the shell. The folded rim around the top of the shell should be about .053" plus or minus .005" to keep shell mouth from opening during storage. If it is not, you might have problems with shells popping open before you shoot them. That folded edge takes at least .110" to .120" of shell wall length to do this. That is almost 1/8th". For the average 16 ga hull, a bit to allow a proper crimp to form.

Put a good straight edge across the top of your finished shell, then measure the depth of the fold just inside the folded rim. .048" is minimum and about .058" is max. .053" is about perfect for most type plastic shells although some shells with thicker, more pliable plastic hull mouth walls like some Federal game load hulls need a bit more fold depth to do the job. you will need a bit more space at the top of the shot column too in this case, by maybe an extra 1/16".

If you have enough shell mouth above the shot to start with, then the amount of shell mouth you use at the crimp fold starting station will affect the size of the hole in your final crimp. Just start with enough plastic shell mouth at the fold starting station first. This will allow you enough plastic to get a nice sharp deep enough fold and enough shell mouth to close the crimp center perfectly flat with no hole in the middle. Then, its a simple matter of adjusting the crimp fold depth screw at the top of your crimp station to get the right depth of crimp. Adjust these two finishing stations by trial and error until you find the right balance for that perfect crimp.

Member Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 43 Location: iowa

i understand what you are saying, i guess it's the fact of matching the right components. in my case, there is no adjustment on the lee loadall.comes down to a case of finding the right feel on the loader! thanks!

And that is why I like the MEC. the Lee load-all works great for some types of hulls like a Remington STS or a WW AA hull. Its what it was designed for. However, once you start messing with non-domestic hulls, it can get right frustrating.

I once had a 12 and a 20 ga Load all unit and reloaded WWAA hulls and Peters Blue Magic hulls on them without a problem. I just could not make them reload Federal standard game load hulls worth a hoot. The hulls would pop open and spill shot all over the place no matter what I did. Once the MEC loaders were adjusted for the Federals, I never had a problem. However, if you can get enough of the right type hulls for the Lee unit, they work just fine. I loaded for 3 years on them without a complaint. Back then, everyone used Remington/Peters and Winchester shotshells.

I can adjust any of the MEC reloaders to handle any hull I happen to get the most of. This is especially important when loading a 16 ga. Because so often, we have to load what we can get enough of and make do.

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

Chances are, the finished length of a reloaded shell won't make any difference. Even the fired length doesn't make that much difference, if you use 2 3/4" hulls in 2 1/2 or 2 9/16" chambers--as long as the pressures are appropriately reduced for guns built to handle those short shells.

Loner
Different hulls will show a little difference in length after loading. No big deal its just some hulls are deeper inside or have more volume. If you take two factory shells from two different makers you will notice they differ in length. Smile

Member Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 43 Location: iowa

The crimps looked pretty good, but the length of the shell was bothering me a little. I was using a BPI SG16 wad with a felt card under 7/8oz of #8 shot in a Fiocchi hull & it didn't seem like I had enough shot in the hull because it seemed the shot didn't fill it high enough, if that makes any sense???? (shot seemed too loose in the hull)

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

If your crimp was ok, you might need to use more filler. Getting 7/8 oz 16ga loads "just right" is not an exact science--nor is reloading, for that matter. But in the case of 16ga 7/8, most of the wads are designed for 1 oz, and the hulls all have too much capacity--some more so than others. So you have to tinker with the filler. You don't want shot rattling around loose. Won't necessarily hurt anything, but it's an indication something's not right with the particular combination of components you're using.

Member Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 43 Location: iowa

Thanks Larry, I've loaded metalic for a few years & this is a little new to me!!!

Have you double checked that you are actually getting 7\8 ounce of shot into the wad?

Member Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 43 Location: iowa

I'm using the 7/8oz bushing from my Lee Load All, I don't have a scale to weigh the shot, Are the Lee shot bushings accurate? I know for sure that the powder bushings are not!!!!! I had to go up 2 bushings to get the grains of unique that i wanted!!!!!

Joined: 01 Dec 2006 Posts: 21 Location: Michigan

Loading shotshells takes a bit of practice to perfect. You are correct in that it does not remotely resemble metalic cartridge loading.

The only advice I would offer is that same caveat found on all published shotshell reloading data, which is to follow the "recipe" exactly and make no substitutions. Any change in components can drastically alter the pressure of the finished cartridge, and it's performance characteristics. Needless to say, a drastic change in pressure can be another spelling of the word D-A-N-G-E-R.

Be careful, keep practicing, and have fun. Smile

How did you load metallics without a powder scale?. you should get an inexpensive scale with at least a 1000 grain capacity for shotshell reloading. Then you can check any shot weight up to 2 ounces. A 500 grain unit will work too but you will have to split any shot drops over 1 ounce. however, for checking powder drops and bushing accuracy, you absolutely need a scale.

Member Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 43 Location: iowa

Frankly, I never thought about checking the shot weight with my scale!!!!! I weighed the charges, which is how I arrived at the fact of the powder bushing discrepancies!!! Embarassed