16ga.com ~ View topic

Joined: 22 Feb 2007 Posts: 21 Location: akron, ohio

Hi everyone, I am new here, but Very glad I foud you all.

My name is Dopey Fudd. I am an avid waterfowle. and a member of www.greatlakeswaterfowler.com .

I am a 99% of the time 16 ga shooter. my primary guns are a sportsman 48, and a 870 express youth.

I am just getting into reloading, and have already ran into an issue. I have bought eveything I need except for the wads.
I will be using 2 different recipies for my loads, for different uses, but not that different.

they will be:

1220 fps
5 shot (*for bunnies)
19.5-19.8 grains of hodgdon universal (dep. on wad)
209 win. primers
rem hulls

the other

1275fps
8shot, (dove, skeet)
20.5 grains of hodgdon universal
209 win. primers

my reloader is fully callibrated to run the first of these recipies.

but the issue I am running into is the wad. I cannot find 1 oz. wads.

as many of you know the winchester waa16 is discontinued.

the remington sp16 are for 1 1/8 oz. pretty much a mag load. which requires a different powder. and not the formula I am using. or add a buffer card below the shot.

I have found 2 other wads for 16 ga. but unable to find recipies. they are:

gualandi
16ga superg mini's

and

ballistic products sporting 16.
does anyone have any info on these wads? they both come in 1 oz.
or should I just use the sp16 with a shot buffer under the shot? and keep everything else the same/

Member Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 317

Well, it depends. In the Remington hull the Gualandi/BP SG-16 (same wad) will be a tight fit. Its designed for straight walled hulls. The rem is slightly tapered to the base wad. This causes a slight bulge in the load when seated deep. Some guys don't like it. Others don't care. Other wads may work better.

You missed the R-16 sale last year. But you can use the SP-16 adding filler if needed. Both wads are interchangeable.

There are other options. I see you're from Akron. Then you should know about Dawson Enterprises off of Rte 30 just west of Canton. (If not, you need to visit that shop for your reloading supplies.) They stock the Windjammer 20 ga. blue wad that should work nicely as a 1 oz wad in the remington hull. I plan to use this wad for some testing this spring. But the dimension look perfect for the remington hull.

Or you can mail order the TC(z)-16 wad from Precision reloading. They are on line. This is a very nice 1 oz 16 ga. wad from B&P (the Italian ammo maker, not BPI).

As far as the recipes you are working with, wad substitution may cause performance variances. I would suggest having them pressure tested by a ballistician before shooting too many of them just to know the actual pressure and velocities your recipes are producing. Especially with that hotter dove load.

Russ

PS I too reside in NE Ohio.

Joined: 22 Feb 2007 Posts: 21 Location: akron, ohio

thank you russ. I have contacted dawson's they are the one who fed me the majorty of my info on the wads.

I am using the standard field oad shells from rem (black)

they recommended using the sp 16 with the buffer.

thanks again.

ps, I checked prescision reloading, that is where I saw the gualandi's

did not see a listing for the tc(z) 16 though.

any thought on the ballistic products sporting 16?

Member Joined: 08 Nov 2005 Posts: 3438 Location: Illinois

Why not set your loader up for a 1 oz. load for both loads at the same speed????The only thing needing to be changed would be the size of shot.Also with the use of overshot wads-not buffer- you could adjust the SP-16 wad to your needs Wink

One .135" (1/8") thick 28 ga. nitro card wad in the bottom of the SP-16 wad converts it to a 1 ounce wad perfectly. Circle Fly Wads will sell you as many of these card wads as you need. The Lyman Shot Shell Reloading Handbook recommends the use of smaller card wads to adjust the depth of a shotcup. So does just about every other reloading manual. It is the easiest, most predictable, and controlable way to modify a wad meant for more shot than needed.

You can use other type fillers like puffed wheat, a wad of paper, rice, foam peanuts, etc as long as the material will not mar steel. However, the card in the bottom lies flat, can be measured and repeated precisely, is under the shot, will not disturb the shot column, and lets the case crimp flat onto the shot normally.

I've been using this method for ages in just about every gauge there is. I've used a 20 ga card in a 12 gauge wad, a 28 ga card in a 16, a 32 ga wad in a 20, and a .410 wad in a 28. They all work for nice light recoiling subgauge loads. you can adjust any plastic shot wad for a lighter than normal shot charge this way.

I used to load 7/8 ounce 12 ga loads long before FITAC required a 24 gram (7/8 ounce) load for competition. I used a Winchester 1 ounce wad with a 1/8th" thick 20 gauge card wad in the bottom of the cup. Now, there is a 7/8 ounce 12 ga wad available. I also loaded 3/4 and 5/8 ounce loads in 20 gauge for quail and for teaching kids to shoot. 28 ga 5/8 or 1/2 ounce loads are like shooting a .410 but with a much better pattern. A simple nitro card wad or wads of the right thickness makes this both possible,very easy and repeatable every time.

We Americans tend to go from gauge to gauge for different purposes. We have been indocrinated by the gun and ammo industry to do this. In Europe, it is more common to adjust the load to the purpose rather than the gun. Consider that a 16 gauge gun will easily handle any shot charge from 5/8 ounce right to 1-1/4 ounce at any reasonable velocity including 1275 FPS with the heaviest shot charge. This means a 16 will handle any kind of game except for the heaviest long range waterfowling dutries as well as any gauge available.

However, Remington, Browning, Winchester and the others would have a hissy if folks started doing this rather than run out and buy another gauge gun. They hve spent big money on advertising and in promoting shotgun games that require different gauges to play it. Skeet was the darling of the industry for years because of this. Now its Sporting Clays and the companies are really pushing sub-gauge events.

Corporate interest is the biggest reason why we Americans do not see 5/8 or 3/4 ounce 20 gauge loads, or 5/8 ounce 28 ga loads. Its also the reason the American gun industry has ignored the 16 gauge gun. It is too damned versitile. They want you to have a 12 and a 20. They will then intice you with upland oriented ads showing a perfectly outfitted dude and his beautiful bird dog hunting in some gorgeous landscape with a beautifully appointed, very expensive 28 gauge O/U or double. the Meassage is that gentlemen of means and experience end up prefering expensive 28 ga guns. The yuppies lap this up like the latest wine in fashion this year.

Don't be suckered in. Learn to reload whatever ammo you need and learn to shoot the gun that fits you best. I can't recommend a better gauge than a 16 for huntng. It does it all if you know how to feed it.

Member Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 450 Location: Indiana

I need to say that 16gg knows what he is talking about. You better listen.