16ga.com ~ View topic

Member Joined: 29 Jul 2007 Posts: 17

I am a new member and wanted to see if anyone was having a similar problem with a 16 ga. Citori. Mine is a Lightning feather model that I purchased new in Dec. of 2003. I only use it for upland hunting. In 04 the gun failed to fire a couple of times. The hits or dents in the primers of the shells is what I would call light. I have only used factory ammo. The gun was fired at most a 100 rounds. I sent the gun back to Browning and they put in new firing pins and springs.
The following year the problem started again. Browning suggested that I try different ammo; I told them that I have tried a few different manufacturers.
I told them that I have another 16 ga. (Ugartechea) that I am using the same ammo with and have not had this problem.
In 06 I switched to firing the upper barrel first, at the end of the season I started having the same problem again, now with the upper barrel. At this time I noticed that the upper firing pin was banged up or dented at the tip. The bottom firing pin looked like it had a mark or scratch in the tip.
Again the gun is only fired 100 to 150 times a year at the most.
I sent the gun back to Browning this winter and wanted someone to call me after inspecting the gun. I put that in writing to them and also called and I was told that was not going to happen.
I have recently got the gun back and the repair said new 16 ga. firing pins and a new main spring. There was no charge. But I am disappointed that no one would talk to me about the problem.
Has anyone heard of a similar problem?

Guest

While I have not had the same problem with my Citori, several of my friends have had similar experiences. I believe in most instances, they were using their guns in wet conditions and in one situation, had their gun completely dunked in the water (blame it their dog). They didn't get their guns serviced immediately afterwards and within a short time had problems with their firing pins. I don know if your gun was used under wet conditions but I usually take my Citori in for a yearly cleanup and checkup by my very competent gunsmith.

Member Joined: 08 Nov 2005 Posts: 3438 Location: Illinois

If you happen to attend The Grand stop by the Browning site and talk to a rep from your area Wink

Member Joined: 18 Nov 2005 Posts: 398 Location: S Fl

It is a physical impossibility for a Clitoris to be unable to fire shells which are gobbled by a cheap gun made with soft Spanish steel.

You are obviously living in a parallel universe. Wink

But seriously, sell the Mikimoto and enjoy your Uggie.

Pete

Guest

Yes, I've heard of that problem. My brother had one of the alloy receivered Citoris and he more than once, in the field, had a failure to fire from the second tube. And he wasn't using promo or off-brand shells. Second time it came back from Browning, he traded it off on something else he desired.

I'm not pooping on Browning or, for that matter, alloy received guns. My 686 UL has been with me for nearly 10 years now, and it's never had a bobble. Just sharing the story as it happened.

Why Browning won't share more info with a customer is a mystery to me.

Member Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 1522 Location: NH

I had a problem with my Feather not firing the second barrel (didn't matter which I fired first) when using light loads. I had the inertia block (I think that's the proper term) adjusted and had no more problems.

That is until the mono block cracked. It is at Browning as I type. Crying or Very sad

First off, you start out very intelligent... your choice of the 16, and your choice of setters.

If it was me... Since you've had this same problem more than once, I'd bring a spare gun along on all hunting expeditions involving the car. And ,if there is a next time, I'd bring the gun to a non-Browning, reputable gunsmith for analysis, and repair. The cjhances are, that whatever imperfect part is in your gun, also rests in their parts bins. A competent gunsmith would be able to circumvent that situation.

After the gun was repaired, I'd then fire off a scathiny, yet polite, letter to Browning corporate offices. The corporate offices seem to care very little about what happens at the repair facilities UNTIL you aim your sights in their direction.

Someone else might tell you to "be persistent". But this is what I would do... if it was me.

Member Joined: 29 Jul 2007 Posts: 17

Thanks to everyone that replied on my Citori issue. Based on the response it appears to be a specific problem with my gun and not a common problem with this particular Citori model.
Hopefully the Browning service dept got it right this last time it was in. Time will tell and I will keep you updated. If it does happen again I will start with the Corp. offices, and depending on their response, I will decide where to go from there. Thanks again.

Unfortunately, this problem with the alloy guns not setting the second barrel is not that uncommon. I've heard of the same problem with a couple locally. One happens to be a new 16 ga model bought two years ago. The owner sent it back for correction. I don't know if the gun was fixed or if the problem remains.

I also do not know if Miroku sleeves the raceways or puts some type of bushing at the rear of the block where the firing pin could impinge on it to reinforce the ally. If the steel pin is impinging or hitting directly against the alloy, then that is where I'd look for a problem. It could be the alloy is being peened and the pins are being impeded a bit. If this is so, any blow back or rearward force against the pins would bend or deform them if they are not fully free to retreat.

I would also advise to never dry fire the gun or drop the hammers on an unbuffered pin. I would use a block of soft brass or aluminum or hard plastic or hard maple placed firmly against the breech face to slow the pins down a bit if I wanted to drop the hammers after breaking down and cleaning the gun for storage. (I never leave my guns cocked for long periods.) I never do it to a steel framed break open gun. I'd absolutely never do it to an alloy frame break open gun.

There might also be another culprit at work here. The shell rims being used might be too thin to properly headspace against the breech face, or the primers are set too deep in the pockets. If the pins are getting too much travel before contacting the primer, or if the primer cap cup is too soft to slow the pin, then the same problem might be happening due to a slightly different cause. The end result would be the same.

I'd also break the gun down and drop a couple of those loads in the barrel. Then I'd check things out with a metal straight edge across the chamber faces to see how deep the shells and the primers are sitting. There should be no more than .008" max under the edge. There is going to be a bit of space in addition when the gun is closed. I believe .010" inch headspace is considered max. Any more and this could be a contributing factor.

This is purely a guess at what might be happening. I do not own an alloy framed O/U or any alloy break open guns. I never was sold on the idea in the first place. I do know that of all the steel Citori models I have owned, only one fairly new one has ever needed the firing pins replaced. One was installed too short and would not hit the primer hard enough to reliably fire the rounds.

I did have a skeet model with about 100,000 rounds through it go back for an overdue service several years back. The gun was gone over at Arnold including new firing pins and came back functioning perfectly again. It is now owned by another shooter who is happily on his way to shooting another 100,000 rounds without any problems at all. In short, the gun should work once it is fixed. If it isn't, then the problem might not be with the pins, but with the design.

Member Joined: 29 Jul 2007 Posts: 17

Some how along the way things got changed to my second barrel not firing. This has never been the case. The first barrel will not fire. I believe the gun is operating correctly when it does not go to the second barrel after the first barrel does not fire.

Originally I had the problem when I was using the bottom barrel first. Last year, I started using the upper barrel first and the problem started occuring with that barrel.

I don't believe it is the shells; I have tried a number of different manufactuers. For the last year and a half I have been using B&P shells. My guess is that the firing pins are hitting or rubbing.

When it does happen, I can put in another shell and the gun will fire.

Like I said hopefully Browning service got it right the last time it was in. I plan on shooting at some clays next weekend.

The Citori has an inertia set system instead of a mechanical one. If the first barrel selected fails to fire, the second hammer will not release, because the small inertia operated blocking cam at the rear of the sear engagement does not disengage.

The correction is to flick the safety back to on and then forward to off in one quick movement of the thumb. this releases the cam. The second barrel will now be armed. If the shooter learns to swiftly do this in case of a misfire, the second barrel will be available for the shot.

Unfortunately today, most of us just stand there flabbergasted that the gun did not fire and watch as the bird flies off to safety. We have been totally spoiled, because our ammo and our guns are so very reliable today. We don't expect a misfire and 99.99% of the time, they don't happen.

Generations of hunters before us were not so fortunate, and learned to compensate for the all too common ammo problems of those days out of necessity.

If you are still experiencing problems after receiving the gun back, I'd contact the corporate office in Utah and lodge a complaint with the customer relations department. They can usually see to it your problem is solved to your satisfaction once and for all. I know it is a pain in the butt to have to go that route. There seems to be a problem that has been brewing at the Arnold, MO service facility over the last year. I expect a shake up if in fact, one has not already taken place. Anyway, I hope your problem gets solved, and you get to enjoy your gun for many years of trouble free service.

Member Joined: 29 Jul 2007 Posts: 17

Browning did not resolve the problem.

I shot the gun maybe 50 times a week ago; I can see that the bottom firing pin is damaged again.

I contacted the Browning Corp. offices and I am dealng with them on this problem.

Member Joined: 29 Jul 2007 Posts: 17

Always have a back-up; multiple guns and two setters.

But Browning is supposedly going to get this resolved very soon.

16's & setters,

I have had the same problem with my 16 gauge Lightning Feather, also an '03 gun. It only began to occur late this past winter at a preserve hunt. I took it to a gunsmith I have faith in, the season was over, and the gun was thoroughly cleaned and stored in the safe.

Due to this gun's lightness, I don't shoot it on the skeet field, and use it only in the field. I can see I've been remiss in not shooting this gun since getting it back from my gunsmith. Thanks to your post reminding me of this issue, I will be shooting it the next two times out for skeet and see how it does.

I suspect my experience will be similar to yours. I have never shot a gun on live birds as well as I do this one, so I'm going to be very displeased when it malfunctions again, as I suspect it will.

I'll report back after shooting it the next two Saturdays on the skeet field. Please keep us informed as to how your situation evolves.

Did Browning acknowledge this problem is common with their Lightning Feathers?