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Spinone
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:46 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Castle Rock, CO

I decided that after many years of hunting with my 20 ga o/u, I decided that I "needed" a sxs. So, I now have a new 16 ga Garbi. My problem is that I don't seem to shoot it very well. I used it on a preserve hunt and went 5 for 5 on chuckar but went 0 for 5 on pheasant. This weekend my dogs pointed over 20 wild roosters and I came home with 0 birds. I am shooting 1 1/8 oz of #6 through fixed chokes ic/m. Most of the shots taken were between 30 and 40 yards. How can I do so well on chuckar and just not seem to hit pheasant? Are the loads just not enough for these longer shots? Please help, my wife is thinking I just bought the most expensive worthless shotgun ever!
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Mr. 16 gauge
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 8:15 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 44
Location: Troy, MI

First off, welcome to the forums.................... Wink

Secondly, how does your new gun fit? Is this your first SxS? Have you shot much in the way of clay targets with it?

While I enjoy preserve hunts, I find that the birds tend to give somewhat closer flushes to the gun. While your load may be 'standard', what is the velocity of your load? I like my loads (in all gauges and weights) to be moving around 1300 fps at the muzzle in order to ensure clean kills on game; if you are using the standard field load of 1 1/8 oz at 1165 fps, that could be the problem.....not enough "ommph", IMHO.
While most pheasant shooters like #6 shot, it is my last choice when I am stictly hunting these birds.....I prefer 1 1/8 oz of hard #5 shot, with a second choice being #4, and finally #6. The #5 will usually give a dense enough pattern while still maintaining enough energy to dump a bird at those distances. Funny, but I just got done doing a preserve pheasant hunt today; of all the birds I shot at and connected with, only one required a second shot. My friend was using a 12 gauge with the standard load of 1 1/4 oz of #6 shot at 1330 fps, and he rocked a few that got away.
Finally, pheasants present a LONNNNNGGGG target with that tail....a lot of hunters become fixated on that plume, and it leads to shooting behind the bird, esp. at longer distances. I/C and modified chokes are a bit open for birds at 40 yards; some hard shot might help to tighten the pattern.

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Spinone
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 8:48 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Castle Rock, CO

Thanks for your thoughts Mr. 16. This is my first sxs and I have not put many rounds through it yet. I have only shot about 25 clays with it. The shells used are a high brass load with a listed 1295 fps. I have some Fiocchi #5 ordered but it won't get here before I head out again this coming weekend.


I know that I need to spend some more time shooting clays with it. The gun fits well, not great but just as well as my 20 ga (which I rarely miss with). I hope the problem is with me not being used to the sxs. I think it is taking my longer to get my first shot off; hence my higher success rate with the closer flushing slower flying chuckar. I know you are right about the difficultly of the pheasant target picture; but it hasn't been much of an issue in the past. I really do hope it is me and practice will drastically improve my shooting.
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Parker Trojan
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 8:53 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 225
Location: San Rafael, CA

My pheasant partner just switched from a Rem1100 to a Birmingham boxlock and the FIRST thing that we did was pattern test the gun for point of aim[does it shoot where you point?] and pattern density with 1 1/16 oz #6 load.The second thing we did was shoot several hundred clays so that he got used to mounting the gun well.Give yourself a chance to get used to the gun.You said that your dogs pointed 20 birds and yet you state that the shots were 30 to 40 yards? Do you have flushing dogs or pointers? I hunt about 50 times a season with a pair of Wirehairs and I shoot a Parker choked I.C. and IM. Mod; the only time I have a 40 yard shot is when I miss with the first shot.Try to shoot some clays on a regular basis and your shooting will improve; above all, don't give up on the s/s.
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fin2feather
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 9:10 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 2171
Location: Kansas High Plains

I have a friend who recently started shooting a sxs after years with a Browning A5. The hardest thing to get used to is getting the barrels up to your shooting plane: switching from an autoloader where the feeling is that the barrel is up on top of the gun, to the lower profile of a sxs. Not sure if changing from an O/U to a sxs is exactly the same, but I'm guessing that's your problem. Work on really getting "into" your gun, getting your head down behind the barrels, and getting the barrels up to the shooting plane you're used to. You may find you need to mount the gun a little higher on your shoulder as well. Just my $.02. I fought it years ago, but my feeling is, once it works for you you'll never look back! Smile

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Spinone
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 9:16 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Castle Rock, CO

Parker Trojan,

No, I haven't patterned the gun yet. I know I should but I just haven't. My dogs are pointers, Spinoni to be exact, and unfortunately the western pheasants I hunt don't always hold a point very long. Laughing So, when the birds are flushing 15 to 25 yards from me and I take what seems forever to mount and shoot, my shots end up being 30 to 40 yards.

I love the new gun and I really think I just need to learn how to shoot it. After all, it only does what I make it do. At what distance should I pattern the shotgun at? Thanks!
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Parker Trojan
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:19 am  Reply with quote
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Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 225
Location: San Rafael, CA

Spinoni: Usually, pattern tests are done at 40 yds and make sure to try several different types of ammo.You can use white paper or actual pattern sheets; if you would like some pattern sheets, pm me. I was tempted to look into the Spinoni line, I think they are beautiful dogs;but I'm shooting over a wonderful line of Wirehairs and will probably stick with them as long as the dogs keep coming out as good as my Zoe.
Fin2 also offered good advise about mount and sight picture; my Birmingham buddy had to adjust his mount for better performance; only took him two weeks to start outshooting me again.
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Terry Imai
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:18 pm  Reply with quote
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Hi Spinone,

I believe Parker is 100% correct in checking where your point of impact (POI) is when your gun is correctly mounted along with a proper cheek mount. If you're not sure with what constitutes a proper mounting technique, maybe a sporting clay lesson with a qualified instructor will be money well spent. Assuming you are mounting and cheeking your gun correctly, then check your POI with each barrel on the patterning board. You need to check both barrels to ensure that each one hit the expected POI. 25-30 yards should be good enough for a upland game gun. Spending money on high velocity loads won't make a bit of difference of whether you hit the bird or not because it only punishes the idiot on the other end of the gun. The fact that you missed 20 straight shot on wild pheasants makes me think the gun fit is so far off that you didn't hit anything even by accident. A positive to all of this is that you're consistant with your sight picture but your gun probably needs to go to an expert gun fitter for some work. Remember, a 1/8" misfit on your stock equates to 18-24" movement of your core pattern of your gun at 30 yards. If your stock is 1/2" off with cast or drop, you'll be a world of hurt. The other thing that concerns me slightly is that if you're working over good pointers and you're taking your first shot at 40 yards, are you spending excessive time measuring your front bead with the bird?? Esp. with a s/s, put all of your focus on the red eye patch and plan on shooting it off the bird and don't worry about your gun bead. Good luck and let us know how everything goes.....

Terry

BTW....I'm envious that you could have the opportunity to miss 20 straight opps on wild pheasants.... Surprised
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john555
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:08 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 76
Location: western canada

Spinone

Your biggest problem was telling your wife about missing the birds. Kidding aside, I suspect your problem is not getting your cheek down on the stock and being unfamiliar with the the large sighting plane that a SxS presents to a shooter for the first time. I shoot autos, pumps, O/U and SxS for game and skeet. It always takes me longer to get into the swing of things with the SxS even though I have owned the guns for many years and shot thousands of rounds with them.

Just relax, get used to the feel of the gun, and you will be knocking birds down just fine. You might want to speed up the process by practicing mounting the gun to your shoulder ten to twenty times every night.

Regards
John
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Parker Trojan
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:34 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 225
Location: San Rafael, CA

Spinoni: Lots of good advise from the gang; I think you'll do just fine. What's a front bead on a s/s? Don't think I've ever looked for one in 35 years of upland hunting. I just point the tubes, cover the bird,fire and keep swinging.If I think too much, I miss.
Good advise on practice mounting your gun 25-50 times a night. I suggest that you do it in your bedroom with the blinds open; tends to keep the neighbors from coming over and borrowing stuff.
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