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Joined: 09 Dec 2007 Posts: 4

I inherited a Browning 16 gauge from my father when I was 8, in 1959. He was an avid duck hunter. My mother said she knew little history but he had it before WWII. Here's what I know: The serial number located in front of the trigger guard is 109034. The original safety was in front of the trigger, now has a modified slider behind the trigger.There is a Cutts Choke on the barrel. But may not be the original barrel. Also the marking on the top of the gun says Browning Arms St Louis Mo.
Hearsay: The gun was modified to accept 2 3/4 inch shells???
I cannot find any information on the Browning site. Thanks for any information or and where I can find research.

Member Joined: 18 Nov 2005 Posts: 398 Location: S Fl

That serial no would put it in 1937.
But I wonder from your description, is the number on the side or bottom (in front of loading port) of the receiver?
Also not sure what you mean by modified slider. The later safety is commonly refered to as a cross bolt.

Photos would by big help.
Pete

Member Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 781

Yup, 1937, in the fall of 1937.

In '37 they were numbering the barrels to the rest of the parts. You can find the serial number on the base of the barrel ring. I suspect it will match because the Browning address you listed is from the right era, 1930-1958.

There are many attributes of the conversion to look at and confirm if the gun was modified for 2 3/4" shells. To keep this simple lets use the simplest difference first......look at the front of the reciever where the barrel fits in. If it was modified there should be about 3/16" of the shiny unblued barrel extension sticking out past the end of the reciever.

Note: if it was reblued this might not be obvious.

Let us know what you see and we'll discuss next steps.

Jeff

ps: Hmmmm, 1937....one more thing to do....look at the sides of the reciever just inside the loading port. Are the flat metal or to they have oval dished out areas in them where metal was machined away?

Joined: 09 Dec 2007 Posts: 4

Thank you for the response to my inquirey. First, the serial number is bottom in front of the loading port. The safety is a "cross-bolt", looks like the one on our 1958 Browning A5 12 ga. The remains of the original safety (I was told that is what it was) still is affixed to the inside of the trigger guard directly in front of the trigger. I'm not sure why or if that is what is was. May be someone could tell me.

After todays work I will examine the gun closer for the 2 3/4 mods.

I am joing the 16 ga and also will post pictures that may help. I'm so glad that there is a place I can ask. I have always kept this gun put up and afraid to shoot it because the rear safty freely slides back and forth depending on the way one holds the gun.

Thank you all for the help.

Member Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 781

Some of the guns that were converted to cross block safeties used the original trigger group and were drilled to accept the cross block. In that case the front of the trigger guard will have a slot in it where the old safety used to be.

Regarding the PS in my last post, this is what to look for in the loading port:

Jeff

Joined: 09 Dec 2007 Posts: 4

Boy you guys are good. First of all questions are mostly true. The other marks on receiver: Looks like an asterick over a backward P, a verticle mark over a crouching lion, over a horizontal line then the letters PV. The same markings are on the chrome shell ejector. The old safety is just as you said. Unfortunately the modified safety will slide completely out if the gun is not cocked.

The barrel that is on this gun has various markings and numbers:

Looking down the barrel on the right side is "Made in Belgium"; on the ring right side is a number 2 inside a circle. On the left side of the barrel on the ring is a star and a number, 110259. On the barrel itself is several markings: 2 3/4" 16 special steel 0Kg884 and the same marking as mentioned in the first paragraph above, the last is worn but looks like 16-65.
on the bottom of the barrel is 16.7 asterick over a K or X then a squiggly mark.
Interesting, the ring is present as mentioned as if the gun was modified from 2 9/16 to 2 3/4 but why is the 2 3/4 stamped on the barrel, unless the barrel was changed out?

Member Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 781

The 15 65 on the barrel are part of the proof marks from when the gun was made measured and proof tested in the Liege proof house. This tells us that it had a 16 ga bore and a cylinder that was 65 mm long.

65 mm is 2 9/15" so we know the gun was made with short chambers as all were in 1937.

It is also clear that the barrel was remarked with 2 3/4" at some later date. The barrel number does not match the reciever so it is likely that the barrel is not original and may have been swapped out by some one who thinks that was all it took to swap it over to shoot the longer shells. It's not.

You need to confirm whether the reciever was also modified to take the longer shells. The visible ring of unblued steel is a clue that it was modified. There are others....here is a link to some of them, unfortunately I think some of the pictures are messed up but it still helps.

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=79647

Jeff

Joined: 09 Dec 2007 Posts: 4

Yes the modifications were made. Also, I have personally shot 2 3/4 on many occasions over the years, only to fine the pattern very large. The barrel has a Cutts ventilated end and a 2.5 in. barrel and site that screws into it. It also has a small shorter barrel that can be screwed on. So, since he was a Duck hunter I assume he swapped the original barrel for the modified one... not really sure.My Mother married in 1947. My Dad had the gun at that time. So, he or previous owner definitely had the mods, changed barrels etc.

I guess it does not matter anymore since I can't use it for waterfowl. I am concerned about the safety as well, so this old soldier may be better in the family display case for sentimental value. I was hoping to get it servicable again.

Thank you for all your help. I have learned much about the gun.

Member Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 781

The shorter extensions are the more open chokes. If the safety is falling out then it can be fixed. It would be a shame to make this gun a "wallhanger".

Get it fixed! Let me know if you need help figuring out what to do to fix it.

Jeff