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<  16ga. Guns  ~  1946 Ithaca 37
662
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 10:19 am  Reply with quote
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Location: Houston

On an impulse, bought an old 37 in 16 ga while I had the chance. Made in 1946, had a lot of rounds through it, some pitting in the bore, terrible finish on the stock, but I figured what the hell, it'll give me something to do.

Took it to the range today, and really like the way it handles. BUT had trouble getting it to eject 5 or 6 times out of the 75 rounds I fired. The empty got stuck and had to be pried out by hand

Looking for ideas as to the possible causes:

1. Cheap ammo--PMC brand, all I could get in a rush? Field loads, 3 1/4 dram, 1 1/8 oz (I know, I need to start reloading).
2. needs a good cleaning and lube job ( I went over it the night before, but not a full disassemble?
3. Just plain worn out and needs new parts?

Would appreciate insights of those who've owned 37's for a while. This is the first one I've owned or shot.

Thanks.
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XVIgauge
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 1:41 pm  Reply with quote
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662,
Most likely it is the ammo. Try to use only Remington or Winchester and I don't think you will have any more problems. If the bore is showing some pitting, then the chamber is probably also corroded and that could also cause the problem. Some 0000 steel wool on a wire brush chucked in a hand drill usually handles this problem. Have it checked out by a good smith for worn parts.
XVI

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Roadkill
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:01 pm  Reply with quote
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Mine (also a 1946 vintage) started leaving them in the chamber. A new upper ejector and spring from Brownell's, less than $20 - easy to replace, no problems since.
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662
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 9:45 pm  Reply with quote
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Thanks, guys. Since my first post I completely disassembled it and cleaned and oiled. It needed it, so I'm hoping that will solve the problem.

Chamber looks OK, if I'm looking for the right things. Don't see or feel any pitting, rust, etc. It's not a mirror finish, but not marred, either.

As for the new ejector, how would I know if I needed a new one? The spring seems good (it should be fairly stiff, shouldn't it?) And the ejector itself seems to be in good shape, physically.

Thanks again.

P.S. after rereading Roadkill's post, I should clarify. They're not being left in the chamber. They're being pulled out of the chamber and then not kicked out. I need a better understanding of the mechanism, I guess, but I think that 's telling me that the ejector wasn't moving freely enough, so maybe the cleaning will help. Will try again at the range next week.
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Roadkill
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 4:07 pm  Reply with quote
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Correction to previous post - that should read upper "extractor" ,not ejector. On Ithaca's IPB it is also referred to as the 'positive extractor'.
I did not know for certain that mine was bad, but it was highly polished on the hook from wear. Since the part was low-priced, and our club sends a monthly order to Brownell's anyway, I tried swapping it out - end of problem.
NRA's "American Rifleman" had a tech article with a complete IPB and takedown procedure for the M37 last year that explained the entire process, otherwise this fumble-fingered amateur would not have attempted the fix.
I don't believe it will correct the extraction without ejection problem, though.
Hopefully the cleaning you gave it will do the trick.
Bill
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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:34 am  Reply with quote
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662, I'm betting it is at least partially the chamber wall finish. It should be smooth to the point of shiny. The walls may be grabbing the shell exterior, particularly if you are shooting shells with plated steel rim material. Steel does not contract after expansion as much as brass. That is why the premium target loads use a brass base--easier and more consistant extraction/ejection, especially in autoloaders and pump guns.

I'd make a chamber polisher out of a 3/8" diameter aluminum rod. Cut a slot crosswise in the end of the rod about 1" deep. Insert the rod into any 3/8" chucked electric hand drill. Then trim off a piece of #300 grit wet or dry metal finishing paper about 1" wide by 8" long. Also take a strip of old inner tube the same width and length. Double fold the first inch of the paper and insert it in the slot. Then place the inner tube strip under the paper and wind them onto the rod in the same direction as the drill will rotate the rod. Wind on just enough material to be able to insert it into the chamber. It should not be too snug. A slip fit will do. Coat the paper with light motor oil, insert the polishing head into the chamber and spin it slowly by hand as you push it into the chamber. Don't start the drill until the polisher is inside the chamber. Also, don't back it out further than just inside the chamber mouth once you start polishing.

About 30 seconds to 1 minute of polishing will do. Let the oil, and grit form a slurry. Repeat for 30 seconds after the slurry has formed. Then repeat the process with #400 grit. Finally, take an old 12 gauge bore brush and cover it with a layer of #000 steel wool. daub on some Flitz, Simichrome, or Puma knife polish (all the same stuff) and finish polishing the chamber By spinning the brush and wool inside the chamber. I normally use the top section of an old cleaning rod to do the last step.

If the bore is rough, the same process will clean it up very well. Simply get a length of rod that will keep the polishing head just below the choke area and adjust the polishing head diameter to fit the bore correctly. Running the rod in and back in the bores will clean and polish them beautifully.

Don't worry about the forcing cone. The edge of the paper will polish it with the chamber. Just don't force the polisher up into the cone. The light grits will not remove any wall material.
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Kivaari
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:01 pm  Reply with quote
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For ejection, I'd look to the carrier. It may be bent. The top extractor, the "positive" extractor, aid in postioning the shell for ejection so it may be unreliable too since it does work most of the time...

Great shotgun, btw; I've a '51 M37, 16 guage




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Scolari
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 7:33 am  Reply with quote
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I own two 37's and both have ejection problems with certain shells. Believe me, cleaning never helped. I did hone the chamber and it did seem to help but still an occasional shell left in the chamber. Winchester shells are some of the worst. There was a discussion obout this problem several months back on this site. If you notice that there are two cut out sections on the barell where the extractors go over the shell rim. If you look at the fired shell, the brass is pushed out where these cut outs are. Some shells don't do this. Fiocchi and Winchester shells leave this bulge. I thought this might make it hard for the extractor to grip the rim. I've tried a lot of things but have never been able to eliminate the problem all togeather. I'm glad to hear that new extractors can be purchased from Brownells. I don't know, maybe the design of the extractors is bad. I'd like to know if the new extractors eliminate the problem. I would like to try them.
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Kivaari
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 9:50 am  Reply with quote
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I think 662 clarified that the problem was "ejection" and not "extraction". A bent carrier could not be removing the shell reliably. Disassemble and take out the carrier and compare to a correct one if it's not clear how it's bent. It can be straightened...
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662
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:14 am  Reply with quote
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Kivaari,

Thanks, you're exactly right--extraction was never the problem, but sometimes the empty didn't eject correctly. I've had the gun apart while I cleaned it (many years worth of accumulated gunk that might have made the extractors particularly stiff and unwilling to yield when it was time to kick the shell out, perhaps?) and refinished the stock.

I'll take it out again soon, I hope, and see if the problem still exists.

Thanks to all for the ideas.

Brian
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lonertoo
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 5:01 pm  Reply with quote
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kivari, this problem sounds like the same problem i have with a fairly new 37 16ga deerslayer.it leaves the extractor marks on lightfield slugs & won't hardly eject them. it shoots winchesters, remingtons & federals just fine! i gave up up on lightfield & now shoot any of the others. this is a rifled barrel & the rifled slugs leave a terrible mess in the barrel, but i don't have much choice!
Dave
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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:32 am  Reply with quote
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if you must use an all lead slug, then try pressing some Thompson/Center wonder/lube 1000 in from the top. Just press in a gob with a butter knife and your thumb until all the rifled grooves on the slug are evenly full. It helps cut down the leading and makes cleaning it out easier. The bore butter does not seriously effect accuracy either and will let you fire 5 to 6 slugs before leading hinders the groups. Without it two or three shots is all you can count on before the group opens and flyers happen.
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lonertoo
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2005 5:13 pm  Reply with quote
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I used to shoot rottweil rifled slugs thru my 20ga 37 & they didn't seem to foul as bad as the other brands. I may try these thru my 16 & see how the accuracy is. The rifling on the rottweil seems to run the same direction as the rifling in the barrel & other slugs run the opposite direction.I wasn't too impressed with the accuracy of lightfield sabots, although they are supposed to be more accurate!
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Lanyard Stretcher
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:21 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 31 Jul 2005
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Location: Central Oregon

Very Happy That looks like my 1940 Mod 37. What a wonderul handling pump gun. Mine doesn't like Fiocchi shells. It has no problems with Federals and resized Fiocchis. Just got to shoot them up first. I bought mine on a whim and killed the first three birds that got up with my first three shots. When I hunt Mountain Quail and Blue Grouse this is the gun I take. 2Lbs. lighter than my A-5.

Mike

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sixteen gunz
PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:23 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 08 May 2005
Posts: 16
Location: oregon

Lanyard Stretcher-
Welcome to the group. I just bought my first 16 a month ago and check this site almost daily and gain information on all aspects of the 16 gauge. Great bunch of very informative guys, glad to have you aboard. Check your pm's.
sixteen gunz
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Last edited by sixteen gunz on Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:29 am; edited 1 time in total
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