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Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Posts: 118 Location: N.Y.

I've got a mess of Federal purple hulls for reloading, but want more of a selection..

What is the more reloadable hull, the black RGL or the Win SuperX Game load?

Opinions please..

For lighter target loads I like the RGL's but I still have 5,000 R-16 wads.

Guest

Traditional reloading manual guidelines advise us that hulls with paper or fiber base wads be reloaded no more than two times and then be discarded. This opinion has been supported by evidence that paper or fiber base wads deteriorate faster than plastic base wads or the bases of one piece hulls. In some rare cases, a base wad can come loose when the reloaded shell is fired and end up in the bore as an obstruction with some dangerous circumstances sure to follow if the wad is not discovered in time.

Each individual must decide for himself what risks he is willing to take in order to conserve his hulls. As long as anyone is willing and able to visually check his bores for an obstruction EVERYTIME he reloads and shoots these type hulls, then there is little danger he or anyone else nearby will be injured from a burst barrel. However, nobody has the right to risk the well being of another person. Nobody is perfect either. We all make mistakes and have lapses of attention to details at times. So it is wise to take the rights and the well-being of others into consideration before deciding a proper course of action in this matter.

So my best advise is to first read several published shotgun reloading manuals about the subject of hull longevity, and then decide how many times to reload the hull in question. I'd also advise anyone to consider the type of gun being used and the time and place where the shooting is being done. At least then an informed decision can be made in the best interests of anyone present.

Below is one of my posts from a rather long and very contentious thread from January about the exact same issue, i.e., fiber and paper base wads. You might want to look it up and read it for more insight into the subject. I also suggest you bring a lunch too. I did say it is long one. i'm not kidding you here. Wink

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I promised everyone concerned I'd print Alliant's answer exactly as it was sent. Here it is:

RE: 16 gauge Federal Game Load hull‏
From: Amonette, Ben (Ben.Amonette@ATK.COM)
Sent: Thu 2/05/09 3:51 PM

We do not know the answer to your question. When it comes to paper base wad hulls, we usually recommend reloading them only 1 or 2 times. However, we do not know how many times you can reload them before they become a safety issue. Thanks for your interest in contacting us and have a nice day.

Ben Amonette

Consumer Service Manager

Alliant Powder Company

PS: Alliant is now the parent company of Federal. 16GG

Member Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 1975

Where did this myth start that the paper basewad would separate from the hull? I have some I have reloaded at least four times and no problem. I even took one apart trying to separate the basewad. I could not do it. I'm not saying I would reload any that had been wet laying in the rain. The basewad itself is harder to cut with a exacto knife then some of the plastic basewads. I also reload the federal topgun hulls in 12 gauge. I feel that for a hunting load they are one of the best. This is just my opinion, but how many can say for certain that they have seen one separate

Base wad separation may also be associated with the reloading tool being used. The Ponsness loaders insert the primer from the bottom, pressing the primer and ram up into the hull, with the hull supported by the die only - no support for the base wad. If the base wad is in any way loose, it is theoretically possible for the wad to be moved up, allowing a passage for the high pressure gasses to get behind the wad and move it out the barrel - again, I say theoretically.

Pacific/Hornady, Mec and RCBS loaders press the hull down onto the primer which sits on a fixed post by pushing down on the base wad - perhaps seating anything that may have come loose. The Ponsness users claim even in the new Winchester plastic 12 ga hulls the separate base insert will sometimes have a separation.

I have reloaded Federal 12 ga paper hulls on a Hornady/Pacific enough times to cause the case mouth to turn into rags and have never experienced a base wad separation.

Member Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 1975

I found out how to seperate the basewads. Drill a couple of holes in the bottom of the hull and take a punch and hammer and with a feww whacks the basewads will come loose. This is on all except the winchester compression formed and the old peters.Also of course the old activ hulls. Allthe others the basewad comes loose. Fiochi, cheddite, the new winchester, BPI hulls
So everything being equal, when reccomending hulls to new reloaders they should be warned about all hulls with seperate basewads.

Guest

I'm really weary of this whole thing about giving old 15gg resounding verbal smack downs but I just have one thing to offer in response to 15gg's response from the gentleman at Alliant Powder. Who are you going to put your faith in, the guys at Federal that have been making these hulls for 20 -25 years with no reports of base wad separation or the guys at the powder company that work up loads.

Guest

As long as you keep the Federals dry, load them until the plastic splits at the crimp like any other hull.

The only time you need to be concerned about plastic hulls with paper basewads is when they get wet and the wound paper swells and tears on the brass protrusions that hold it in place.

Joined: 15 Jan 2009 Posts: 728

If the paper basewads can separate from the hull and travel down the barrel then any basewad that is not an integral part of the hull can do the same thing.

I have reloaded a lot of Federal hulls with paper basewads without a problem but that doesn't mean there won't be one with a Federal or any other hull with a separate base wad for that matter. I removed the paper basewad from a twice-fired 16 gauge Federal hull that sat under the snow on a skeet field through a New England winter. It required a bench vise, hack saw, needle nose pliers, nail punch and five minutes of considerable effort to remove that paper basewad. That doesn't mean that a paper or any other basewad can't come loose and travel down the barrel or that you shouldn't carefully examine the base wad, paper or otherwise, of every hull with a good light source before you put the hulls in your reloader.

The fact is that the force applied to base wads during firing pushes them into the base of the hull (away from the barrel) because base wads are located behind the powder charge and the primer ignition point. This means that the chances of a base wad slipping out of the hull and getting stuck in the barrel are very small, but it does exist.

A friend of mine has a 9" scar on his calf from a piece of an adjacent shooter's barrel that ruptured halfway through a round of trap. The gun was in good shape before the incident and the shells used were factory new but it is still possible that a base wad obstruction caused the barrel rupture. The lesson is that there is no such thing as being too safe when it comes to shooting or reloading.

*Last edited by 16gaugeguy on Mon May 11, 2009 4:40 am; edited 2 times in total*

Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Posts: 118 Location: N.Y.

Jeeeesh,

I have loaded a few shells, just a few, over the years..
I'm not concerned about basewad seperation or what I would need to do to make one seperate..
Just interested in which hull crimps the best, and I can take the farthest..

Thanks for all the replies.

Member Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 1975

16gg. I do not think this is silly. You keep bringing up the paper base wad in the federal hull as the one with the warning in the reloading manual. When in fact the warning in the reloading manual is for all hulls made with seperate basewads. Your warning and the posting from Alliant would make a person new to reloading think that the federal hull should not be reloaded.
Why not just say that any hull with seperate basewad should be examined carefully after 2 or 3 reloadings. Also that any hull with paper basewad that is wet should never be reloaded. I think that would be sufficient. Also why not inform them that when reloading with a Mec or the lowly loadall the basewad is held in place when repriming a hull. Also tell them to buy a small LED flashliight like the one I own and inspect down inside the hull after depriming. I deprime all my hulls and inspect them and put them in there seperate containers untill I'm ready to reload again.
Another thing, I think a letter or email from federal would be better then from Alliant. After all they have been making these hulls for how many years.

*Last edited by 16gaugeguy on Mon May 11, 2009 4:41 am; edited 2 times in total*

Black & Tan,
I agree with what ever everybody said before so as to not cause you any harm I recommend that you send me all your federal hulls immediately Exclamation

Charlie