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I am sorry you folks are having issues with the new wad , I know just what you folks mean .

I am constantly going over to Ole Ben's and adjusting this or that on his loader to accomodate what he is attempting to accomplish , Ole Ben has no Mechanical Skills so I fully understand your plight .

I see Mark deleted his postings in dismay at the subject , he said perhaps you could call customer service for some help with your loaders .

I can sure tell you that the 18 gram loads will only fit in the RGL Hulls but the 21 Gram fits all the other hulls with no dishing if you USE NO WAD PRESSURE AT ALL .

I have loaded 25 rounds of each wad currently available and all hulls from past and present , after placing the loads in my commercial tumbler for 10 minutes then diasected the hulls to verify the migration of each hull wad combination .

I am very happy with my wad and its overall perfomance in all sectors of testing .

Perhaps customer service will be able to work you through your delima's

Regards Charles

Guest

Thanks Charles,

I don't always explain things simply enough, I guess.

For MEC customer service call - 1-800-797-4MEC

For Ponsness Warren customer service call - 1-800-732-0706

These folks ought to be able to see you gentleman through your crimping problems.

Thanks Tony :

Your observations are appreciated , but you and others ask for a one wad to fit all , well you have it .

I explained in the development of the wad that it was the Bridgeport Mill of wads ( a Bridgeport does it all , Mill , Drill , Broach , Bore , ect . but it does nothing well such as a dedicated machine will , but it does do it all ) .

The DR16 wad will load the 18-28 Gram Loads in the hulls currently produced and all past hulls , is it the best wad for a dedicated load , NOT BY A LONG SHOT ( we already have load specific wads , R16 , 1618-21 , AA16 Clone , Trap Commander , ) but it is the only wad ever developed that WILL DO IT ALL . This is what everyone ask for , I call it the Bridgeport Wad of Wads .

The HS-6 powder you mentioned is the old 540 Winchester and is not even a consideration powder for this wad , way too slow .

But you had the right idea on the powder grain size , the testing was done with the old 452 Winchester so size is not an issue with the wad .

But hey one of the great things now is that you can always purchase the True Sized AA16 Clone from Claybuster so that should fit all your requirements I should think , I will keep loading my wad just the way I designed it .

Thanks for the input .

Regards Charles

Member Joined: 07 Jan 2008 Posts: 348 Location: Missouri

Charles,

Thanks for giving us a great option for our 7/8 oz loads.

I'm loving this DR16 with the Win Super X hull and Fiocchi hull.

No complaints here.

Cheerios and Pinto Beans are back in the food cabinet where they belong!!! Very Happy

Amen Jim. Nick, no matter what you do or how you do it, you will never please them all. It will take time, but most folks will find a way to make the wads work. We are far better off than we were a few months ago thanks to you. Don't forget that most of the folks who are happy with these wads will simply buy them and use them without much comment. That is the way it always seems to go. I think time will prove you did a great job on these wads.

Always remember; the mark of anyone who openly and honestly does anything for anyone worth anything to anyone are the calluses on his ass. Very Happy

(No good deed goes unpunished.)

For reference I am loading on a MEC 9000 (non hydrualic) 16g machine. I have made 1000's of shells on it, mostly Fed/Estate and Cheddite 2 3/4" hulls. I've experienced loose wads but the DR16 takes the cake. Rammer tube height doesn't matter, the new wad sinks down on top of the powder no matter how tube is set, once the weight of the shot is on it. No friction. Looking closely at the new wad, the gas seals seem ill-pronouced, and thats the problem. They could gouge out the mold a hair at the seal rings to fix. I agree w Tony's suggestions.

Oh well, I'll go back to the SG16 which is excellent using a meat tray filler for my 7/8oz loads.

Then again, shot price has dropped back to $26 a bag (thank god!) so a lot of my rationale for using the 7/8 loads is out the window. All good things to he who waits.
Thanks guys for all the input, let's continue to discuss.
Best RIZZY

Guest

Rizzini and Shootingsioux,

-0- wad pressure and 1/2 turn out on the final crimp die on a MEC machine don't seem like mind boggling adjustments. The powder migration issue is a non-issue unless you are using ball-type powders, which with the DR16 being a 3/4 - 7/8 oz wad, would be one Winchester powder.

I would bet that you fellows have an axe to grind with the DR16 and /or the gentleman the designed it, not sure why, and I don't care.

Guest

Tony,

Sorry if my response was uncalled for in your case.

I guess my issue with this thread is that guys got the wad that they wanted for 3/4 -7/8 oz. loads. It fits properly in all the hulls we currently have. Based on my work with this wad, I haven't had any powder migration problems with Clays, Universal Clays, SR7625, American Select, and Green Dot. I haven't tried PB but that is the same kernel size as SR725.

As far as crimping goes, an adjustment is normal for almost any significant component change.

You could stiffen and/or shorten the compression section and lengthen the shotcup but that just raises the pressure and lowers the velocity, which forces you into using more of the medium burn rate powders. I would rather use the fast rate powders as they are FAR easier to get consistent ballistics with. It would also make the wad less verstile, as it narrows the payloads weights that it can cover and also possibly limit the various hull lengths that you could use.

Until we got the Euro wads in the USA, all our wads slid freely in the straight walled hulls. Never had much problem before, why is it an issue now? I have shot cases of WAA16 wads in Remington RGL hulls no problems and a few cases of SP-16 wads in Federal hulls with no problems.

This wad will load a greater number of payloads because of the way it was designed, without using fillers. Guessing from 5/8 to 15/16 oz.

I believe that because it acts a little different than any other wad you are used to, there is some apprehension. A little patience is in order before we start redesigning the DR16.

I am not much for sub-gauge loads in the 16, but I have shot quite a few of these wads with Universal powder, 7/8 oz. of shot, in Cheddite hulls in my 1100. They work fine, and crush targets nicely. I have also used American Select and Clays with 3/4 oz. of shot in Cheddite hulls in my pumpguns with the same satisfactory outcome. (This wad has changed my mind concerning sub-gauge loads, in certain applications.)

I think folks need to reload and actually shoot something with this wad, before they throw it under the bus.

Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Posts: 118 Location: N.Y.

Why must we always attempt to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory?

The internet is a great source of information. Unfortunately, it's also the premier source for disinformation! So, I retrieved my trusty mike, which still works after three years of retirement, to see for myself. The results??

DR-16 .654-.657 outward flare the entire wad, including seal rings is sharp and well defined.

R-16 .632-.635 inward flare at sealing flange

Sporting-16 .662-.664

TC-16 (Z wad) .662-.668 also slightly inward flared

So, for a group that have been forced to use 20 ga. wads in certain applications, we should be welcoming this wad and working through the learning curve. And BTW, I don't have a 20 ga. wad here that measures over .600.. The dimensions are exactly in the ballpark, so loose fitting, tight fitting is all just so much trivia.. We're dealing with molded pieces of plastic, in both hulls and wads, not finely machined metals that are truly round and true to size..
This wad is perfectly servicable, and anything that will cut out the added step of setting a cheerio in the shotcup before dropping shot is a plus in my book..
But, there is room for debate.. We don't all have to view the world though the same colored glasses..

The wad for me does everything it's supposed to do.. and that's all I wanted from it.

Guest

Slide,

I am going to remember this saying,

Don't play in the mud with the pigs, you get dirty and the pigs like it!!

Well said Black and Tan. Your measurements and observations are right in line with mine. There is nothing better than a well deployed mike to cut right through the horse manure.

And yes, molded plastic objects will vary. We can accept it and use the wads, or we can go back to cobbling these nice light loads together with the same old make do stuff we were using before these wads were offered. Its a step backwards IMO.

The only other option is to beg the ammo companies to offer us 16 ga. 3/4 and 7/8 ounce target and recreational loads. Don't hold your breath here folks. Some of these yahoos have been trying to kill the 16 gauge for a long time. Some of them do not like these wads one bit either. They love to hear us whining. Its just more proof for their claims the 16 is a dead gauge. Then they can go right on hiking the price on their 28 ga loads and guns and laugh in our faces on the way to the bank.

Member Joined: 02 Oct 2004 Posts: 425 Location: Maine

I just loaded on my MEC 9000, 3/4 oz. with the DR16's, and claydot powder in Cheddite and Federal 2¾ hulls, no fillers. Same press settings as I use for 7/8 with Gualandis, and 1 oz. with claybusters in these hulls.

Crimps arn't perfect, but they 'aint dished.

Note the height of the rammer tube in relation to the DR16 sitting on the wad guide. Yes, I had to hacksaw 0.50" off the rammer tube and funnel to get the rammer up that high w/o tipping the bottles over on the upstroke Rolling Eyes

P.S. Rizzy, those are the same Cheddites I scammed from you at the last shoot. By my estimation, they still have about 10 loads left in them, so you can have them back at the next shoot Razz