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I am interested in buying a new 16 gauge sxs for sporting clay's and skeet. I hunt with an old Fox 16 and an LC Smith ideal grade 16. However I shoot a 16 gauge Citori lightning all summer. I think its time to have a sxs target gun. I always prefer to buy american but I don't have any options here. My question is whats the strongest sxs on the market. My guess would be a merkel. I handled a ugartechia 16 gauge boxlock that was very nice and an aya boxlock. I shoot about 1200 to 1800 rounds a year through the gun and want it to hold up like my Citori. Any suggestions ?

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

PP, a Merkel would certainly work for you. If I were looking for a sxs target gun and focusing on Merkels, I'd probably go with a 47E. They're heavier than a 1620, which is pretty light for a target gun--in fact lighter than either your Fox or Elsie, I'm pretty sure. 47E is also cheaper than a 1620.

You would think so, but most of the 47E models I see are higher than the 1620. Of course, none are selling either. Most of these guys are sucker fishing or trying to fool the wife into thinking they are really trying to sell it.... but "Geez Hon, nobody wants it right now and you would not want me to give it away would you."

That scam is straight out of "gun running past the wife 202, the intermediate course. Chapter 4--what to do if the wife smartens up."

I didn't see a 47e in 16 gauge listed on GSI web site. I don't mind recoil at all if the 1620 is just as strong. I can always add a little weight if needed. I'm still young and have magnumitis I like to shoot 1oz of shot at 1280 to 1300 fps for sporting clays. Where is the best place to buy a Merkel in the northeast I don't see many.Cabelas is the only dealer in Eastern PA and there prices are not to good on guns.

Member Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 1522 Location: NH

Merkel makes the 47E in 16 as I have one. Handles sweet.

Try www.merkelclearinghouse.com

They don't list the 16 in the 47E either but a phone call to them and they can most likely get one.
Also check gunbroker.com under Merkel. There is a guy on there that sells Merkels all the time and says he can get any one you want if he doesn't have it.

One of those will most likely be where I get my next Merkel from.

FYI.

There's a used 47E listed on this webpage:

http://www.gunshop.com/quala2.htm

I have a 1620 which is quite light for clays (6-6 1/4 lbs), but the above website also has them listed for a much better price than Cabelas.

Hc

Member Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 1522 Location: NH

Member Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 1522 Location: NH

KB16,
To answer your first question, yes, the 1620 can be had with a set of 20 ga. barrels. It's the 1620 combo. You can also have a set of 20 ga. barrels made for an existing 1620 if you send your gun back to them.
I'm not sure if they will make a set for a 47E or not. Don't see why they wouldn't as they offer the 47E in 20 ga. Only thing to consider would be that one could most likely find a used 47E in 20 ga for just a bit more as compared to what a new set of barrels would cost you.

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

I saw the Quality Arms 47E 16, and if you go to gunsamerica.com and search under Merkel, I think you will also find another 47E 16 or 2 with an asking price low to mid-$2K. Cannot recall having seen a 1620 recently listed for under $3K.

Couple other good possibilities, if you're looking used, would be the Sauer Royal. A nice one should set you back something under $2,000 in 16. Bernardelli 16's are also out there, although you have to be a bit patient. I had a nice Roma 3E 16, probably should have kept it. Used prices should be similar to the Sauer Royal. But be careful with Sauers! Although they're all nice, well-made guns, the prewar ones are light and mostly short-chambered. If you're thinking a lot of target shooting, that's probably not what you're after.

KyBrad16ga,

Sorry, I cannot answer your question on new vs old. I saw the same thread that you are referring to. Keep in mind that there is always a diversity of opinions on any gun, or anything for that matter. My opinion is to buy a nice used gun and you will get your money back if you take care of it and probably more if keep it a few years. I bought a 1620 because it was exactly what I wanted for a western plains hunting gun - - a lot of walking and not much shooting. I have a nice light 20ga but I wanted something with more punch. That same thread also had a post in it that the poster couldn't see why Merkel could stay in business with their over-valued prices. I cannot comment on that either, but If they did fold, my 1620 would just appreciate that much more.

If you are considering a 47E, then don't ignore the 12ga as the 16 and 12 weigh about the same. Cabela's Gun Library has a very nice 12 with Brley chokes that you can probably negotiate the price on. I bought the 1620 from Cabela's and got $400 of the price..

To summarize, buy what you want and buy it used, and you cannot go wrong. It has worked for me for 30 yrs.

Hc

Member Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 1522 Location: NH

Called GSI this morning the 47E in 16 gauge is discontinued. Only the 1620 is available and only a 16 will do I have no need for a 12 gauge. I have a red label 12 to shoot geese with course steel shot and an old 12 gauge NID from my grandfather. I don't believe I ever shot clays or upland birds with anything other than a 16.

I think that the only clear choice for an American made 16 gauge target gun is the M 21. Originals abound, and CSMC will build one for your needs with a lifetime guarantee.

This is the best, strongest, American made gun IMHO.

PP, I'm only guessing you want a little more weight in the gun to absorb some of the recoil and track on clay targets better. You stated you want a strong one. I think one of the used Savage/Fox model B guns in 16 with 28" barrels might suit you.

They are heavy, but they are also rugged. They are relatively inexpensive compared to the general run of SxS guns. The barrels are also thick enough for aftermarket choke tubes like Colonials or Tru chokes. They are a tad heavy for a 16 upland gun. but you have others for that purpose. They also would certainly hold up to light target loads very well. You could also modify the stock to suit you without messing up an expensive piece or a fine collector. Rebalancing by adding a small bit of lead in the stock would also make the gun a bit more responsive than it usually is by shifting the center of gravity slightly to the rear and more between the hands. 16GG